Dr. Rich Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 Jesus was the Passover Lamb and was killed by Hid own Father on the exact time the Passover lamb was to have been killed. That was just before sunset on Wed. not Thurs. 72 hours from that time would have been just before sunset on Sabbath--showing that Jesus rose from the grave before they got to the tomb just after sundown on Sat. which by their time would have been the first day--it being started at sundown.
Members phkrause Posted January 10, 2012 Members Posted January 10, 2012 Your comments deviate from relevancy when you call Samie names. My comment was directed to the fact that if you treated name calling with the same distain that you show towards sarcasm your comments would carry a greater,more focused impact on the discussion.Your form of communication is already difficult for me to decipher and adding belittling tags to the mix detracts even more from what otherwise seems to be an important and meaningful contribution. As for my other, irrelevant comments, you are probably right so feel free to ignore them.I have nothing substantial to contribute to any discussion of Greek other than I feel confident enough in God's ability to direct Bible translators to understand it's meaning well enough to clearly get His message across (despite what Samie is convinced of)to the rest of us. Excellent, excellent point Doug phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Members phkrause Posted January 10, 2012 Members Posted January 10, 2012 I knew this would be a "hard" topic so I stayed out for the most part as I could see no resolution could be made. I know there is a right answer and there is hidden facts that few know of to consider and most are not versed well in math well and the things of discord that were present at that time. To start with there was two passover times kept by two different methods of determining a new moon which the feasts are determined by. It makes several things come out that are hard to understand in the new testament and some had to do with Paul's travels and whether he had time to make it to a place in so short a time. Well Paul did have plenty of time, it was two days difference in that reckoning. It just requires hard study and putting it together that is hard to follow unless contemplated on for some time until it is solidly seen. Jesus and the disciples kept Passover the right day though you all can be sure. 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. I can agree to a certain extent. Having said that, I don't find it to be to difficult. The Bible is pretty plain as to what day Jesus died and than rose. As far as "I could see no resolution could be made." I think we can apply that to almost every thread. There are no athoroties(sp) here, so most or all comments are basically opinions as to what we believe. Obviously there are some opinions that are truer than others. phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Members phkrause Posted January 10, 2012 Members Posted January 10, 2012 Gibs - As the verse cited in your post says, 'it was the preparation day', which is always Friday, the day prior to the Sabbath, and this day was always on Friday, and still is. phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Aussiemike Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 So Jesus was resurrected on a Saturday inspite of the fact that the scripture says that he was resurrected on the first day of the week! Like waves on the sea shore the nonsense just keeps rolling in.
Guest Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 So Jesus was resurrected on a Saturday inspite of the fact that the scripture says that he was resurrected on the first day of the week! Like waves on the sea shore the nonsense just keeps rolling in. I agree!
Members phkrause Posted January 10, 2012 Members Posted January 10, 2012 Originally Posted By: Aussiemike So Jesus was resurrected on a Saturday inspite of the fact that the scripture says that he was resurrected on the first day of the week! Like waves on the sea shore the nonsense just keeps rolling in. I agree! phkrause When the righteous are in authority, the people rejoice; But when a wicked man rules, the people groan. Proverbs 29;2
Guest Posted January 10, 2012 Posted January 10, 2012 SD: DR Rich, it's a lot, but no - nil - sultsch - zero Scripture. Congrats! Congrats 2.0 on zero Scripture!
Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted January 10, 2012 Administrators Posted January 10, 2012 Moderator tip of the day: Posting everything in bold and/or larger font gives the impression that you are shouting or yelling. Use both sparingly to add emphasis as you might change the pitch, tone or cadence of your voice to emphasize a word while speaking. "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.)
jamesonofthunder Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Jesus was the Passover Lamb and was killed by Hid own Father on the exact time the Passover lamb was to have been killed. That was just before sunset on Wed. not Thurs. 72 hours from that time would have been just before sunset on Sabbath--showing that Jesus rose from the grave before they got to the tomb just after sundown on Sat. which by their time would have been the first day--it being started at sundown. which calender are you reckoning this Passover from? Did you know that out of all of the Jewish calenders the dates have been confused to the point where there there is no plausible conclusion that can be drawn? We only have the bible record to go by now. The only Jewish calendar that the Spirit of Prophecy or historical Adventist used was called the karaite calendar (which is how they computed October 22, 1844) but even the so called modern day karaites have confused their own historical comprehension lately. (mainly to detract from Adventists using their calendar). I believe you are also forgetting that Jesus bade the disciples to have their Passover meal the night of His betrayal. Do you think Jesus would break His own ceremonial law? There were two different groups of people keeping two different Passovers that week. The Spirit agrees that at the moment of the almost slaying of the so called Pascal Lamb in the temple, Jesus died on the cross, but this shows this group had no clue what they were doing or they would have been at the cross, why would you go to them for enlightenment? He also was "Cut off" (Dan 9:26) from the Father in Gethsemane the same evening Jesus had the true Passover meal. All of the Atonement connected sacrifices were fulfilled between Thursday night and Sunday Morning. Please be careful brother because you do not know what you are doing in the same spirit as written here... "Satan presented before them the glorious resurrection of Jesus, and told them that by His rising on the first day of the week, He changed the Sabbath from the seventh to the first day of the week. Thus Satan used the resurrection to serve his purpose. He and his angels rejoiced that the errors they had prepared took so well with the professed friends of Christ. What one looked upon with religious horror, another would receive. Thus different errors were received and defended with zeal."
jamesonofthunder Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 "Christ rested in the tomb on the Sabbath day, and when holy beings of both Heaven and earth were astir on the morning of the first day of the week, he rose from the grave to renew his work of teaching his disciples. But this fact does not consecrate the first day of the week, and make it a Sabbath. Jesus, prior to his death, established a memorial of the breaking of his body and the spilling of his blood for the sins of the world, in the ordinance of the Lord’s supper, saying “For as often as ye eat this bread, and drink this cup, ye do show the Lord’s death till he come.” And the repentant believer, who takes the steps required in conversion, commemorates in his baptism the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ. He goes down into the water in the likeness of Christ’s death and burial, and he is raised out of the water in the likeness of his resurrection—not to take up the old life of sin, but to live a new life in Christ Jesus. {3SP 204.2}
jamesonofthunder Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 "But still the disciples seemed unbelieving. Their hopes had died with Christ. And when the news of His resurrection was brought to them, it was so different from what they had anticipated that they could not believe it.... From eyewitnesses some of the disciples had obtained quite a full account of the events of Friday. Others beheld the scenes of the crucifixion with their own eyes. In the afternoon of the first day of the week, two of the disciples, restless and unhappy, decided to return to their home in Emmaus, a village about eight miles from Jerusalem...."{CTr 295.3}
jamesonofthunder Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Many honest Sunday-keepers who keep Sunday believing it was His resurrection day will become Sabbath-keepers once they come to know the Lord rose from the grave Saturday. Please Samie reconsider and correct this statement, because Yahweh is very upset at statements like this from His professed followers. He is ashamed of you for this and you WILL be lost if you do not correct your views. The only other options if you do not comply will be for you to leave His church. You chose. This is not the Seventh Day Adventist view and never will be nor should you claim it to be before His people. Very sad, Brother James.
jamesonofthunder Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Here is the best support I or the Spirit of Prophecy can give as to when the passover was... "After the hymn, they went out. Through the crowded streets they made their way, passing out of the city gate toward the Mount of Olives. Slowly they proceeded, each busy with his own thoughts. As they began to descend toward the mount, Jesus said, in a tone of deepest sadness, “All ye shall be offended because of Me this night: for it is written, I will smite the shepherd, and the sheep of the flock shall be scattered abroad.” Matthew 26:31. {DA 673.1} "In company with His disciples, the Saviour slowly made His way to the garden of Gethsemane. The Passover moon, broad and full, shone from a cloudless sky. The city of pilgrims’ tents was hushed into silence. {DA 685.1} Jesus had His last Passover meal then entered Gethsemane under the Passover moon, then He was "Cut off" from the Father dying the second death!!!! He drank the cup in Gethsemane in fulfillment of the new and everlasting covenant proclaimed that evening in the upper room during the last supper. AMEN!!! I love it when God gives clear instructions for us.
Gibs Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 Passover was the fourteeth day of the "moonth" and Israel left Egypt under a full moon. The first Passover. Ex 12:23 For the LORD will pass through to smite the Egyptians; and when he seeth the blood upon the lintel, and on the two side posts, the LORD will pass over the door, and will not suffer the destroyer to come in unto your houses to smite you. Ex 12:13 And the blood shall be to you for a token upon the houses where ye are: and when I see the blood, I will pass over you, and the plague shall not be upon you to destroy you, when I smite the land of Egypt. Ex 12:14 And this day shall be unto you for a memorial; and ye shall keep it a feast to the LORD throughout your generations; ye shall keep it a feast by an ordinance for ever. Ex 12:42 It is a night to be much observed unto the LORD for bringing them out from the land of Egypt: this is that night of the LORD to be observed of all the children of Israel in their generations. 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. A Freeman In Jesus Christ
jasd Posted January 11, 2012 Posted January 11, 2012 QR frame: There is Writ, and there are writings. There are texts, and there is lyrical prose.
jamesonofthunder Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Brother take a deep breath OK? No one thinks your puff. But take this into consideration. Genesis says; And the evening and the morning, the first day. And the evening and the morning, the second day. And the evening and the morning, the third day... This is how God always instituted the Holy days and festivals. The passover in Egypt when God sent the destroying angel was at sundown, then they left in the morning. There was a separate calendar just for holy things. Everything Holy was Holy and everything common was common.
doug yowell Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Moderator tip of the day: Posting everything in bold and/or larger font gives the impression that you are shouting or yelling. Use both sparingly to add emphasis as you might change the pitch, tone or cadence of your voice to emphasize a word while speaking. You might also mention that writing in complete sentences using wording that is clearly understood contributes more to the interaction than the use of Navajo Code communication that leaves many of the readers asking "What in the world did he say?"
jasd Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 >>writing in complete sentences using wording that is clearly understood<< We may have to allow SD some leeway, as, I believe, he is from South Africa - and his style may reflect an inherent difference in communication. For instance: I notice that he often colloquialy utilizes lexemic punctuations. Fragmentary sentences are thought grammatically permissible if the general community of thought is in view. Disabuse me should I err. Anyway, I've seen on these boards the inability to grasp the most beautifully lucid writing. We muddle, one and all. Those who are able to gather some sense from my writing are commended, as I write to a large degree - for myself - in my own manner.
doug yowell Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 >>writing in complete sentences using wording that is clearly understood<< We may have to allow SD some leeway, as, I believe, he is from South Africa - and his style may reflect an inherent difference in communication. For instance: I notice that he often colloquialy utilizes lexemic punctuations. Fragmentary sentences are thought grammatically permissible if the general community of thought is in view. Maybe so but Jesus asked us to feed His sheep not His dialectic giraffes.
doug yowell Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Those who are able to gather some sense from my writing are commended, as I write to a large degree - for myself - in my own manner. And, due to it's clarity I'd like to be the first to trumpet that this has been one of your best!!
Administrators Tom Wetmore Posted January 12, 2012 Administrators Posted January 12, 2012 Originally Posted By: Tom Wetmore Moderator tip of the day: Posting everything in bold and/or larger font gives the impression that you are shouting or yelling. Use both sparingly to add emphasis as you might change the pitch, tone or cadence of your voice to emphasize a word while speaking. You might also mention that writing in complete sentences using wording that is clearly understood contributes more to the interaction than the use of Navajo Code communication that leaves many of the readers asking "What in the world did he say?" It is a fact of life that the style in which one posts contributes significantly to the degree to which others will bother to pay attention and respond. Another example is long posts. They most often get skipped or skimmed at best. It's a sort of life lesson. If we don't communicate the gospel in the language, style of communication, vocabulary, etc. of the people we seek to reach, we fail. "Absurdity reigns and confusion makes it look good." "Sinless perfection is such a shallow goal." "I love God only as much as the person I love the least." *Forgiveness is always good news. And that is the gospel truth. (And finally, the ideas expressed above are solely my person views and not that of any organization with which I am associated.)
Gibs Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Long videos fall in the same category, most folks attention span is less than 20 minutes it is found so a sermon ought to get it's message out in less if at all possible. Give the punch line, then lay provable groundwork without going way up and around "robinhoods barn". 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. A Freeman In Jesus Christ
jamesonofthunder Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Originally Posted By: jamesonofthunder Brother take a deep breath OK? No one thinks your puff. But take this into consideration. Genesis says; And the evening and the morning, the first day. And the evening and the morning, the second day. And the evening and the morning, the third day... This is how God always instituted the Holy days and festivals. The passover in Egypt when God sent the destroying angel was at sundown, then they left in the morning. There was a separate calendar just for holy things. Everything Holy was Holy and everything common was common. SD=GE: I must take a deep breath; not post the Scriptures on the "three days", because "Genesis says" ... in conflict with the Gospels? That's your method of solving problems of one's faith? When am I going to stop to be so surprised?! I was trying to prayerfully help. If you're looking at the code of scripture in the feast days and not using the foundation of the bible (Genesis) to support your theory then you have no foundation. Every one of the Holy days were started at sundown, ALWAYS! Just like the Sabbath starts at sundown. God used creation to illustrate a point, the goal of all of scripture is to get back to the Garden, recreated in the image of Christ. So everything to do with the ministry of Christ in fulfillment of the Holy Days is governed by creation. The Jewish people didn't even have a 'Common' calendar to be confused by until Babylon took them captive, they only had the Holy Calendar 'till their fall. This is similar to Adams fall from the Garden. When they were conquered next by Medo-Peresia and again by Greece and Rome, more and more changes occurred to the common calendar, up till the Caesars taking days from other months for the month they named after themselves, like July after Julius Cesar. The only calendar not effected by these changes was the Holy calendar, which was also having changes made by the different sects of Jews, which is why there were two different groups keeping two different Passovers at the time of Jesus dying on the cross. This is all historical. The only thing that was never messed with in all of this change is the weekly Sabbath and when HOLY DAYS began at sundown. I can prove it! I am praying for you brother. It is hard to kick against the pricks.
jamesonofthunder Posted January 12, 2012 Posted January 12, 2012 Originally Posted By: jamesonofthunder Brother take a deep breath OK? No one thinks your puff. But take this into consideration. Genesis says; And the evening and the morning, the first day. And the evening and the morning, the second day. And the evening and the morning, the third day... This is how God always instituted the Holy days and festivals. The passover in Egypt when God sent the destroying angel was at sundown, then they left in the morning. There was a separate calendar just for holy things. Everything Holy was Holy and everything common was common. SD=GE: Jameson, are you serious with this post? Do you explain the last "three days" of Jesus' last passover with the first three days of the creation?! Unbelievable. Every day on this thread I think I have seen the ultimate; only the next moment to find out the ultimate was much bigger. Did you know that in the Red Heifer cleansing ceremony which had to be endured if you came in contact with the dead or you could not take part in the Atonement, when they put you and your family out of the camp, the sprinkling to cleans was done on the 3rd and the seventh day? The counting of the days began at sundown. If you prayed about this you would see what is right. Jesus died the 2nd death symbolic of the Red Heifer in Gethsemane on the night of His betrayal and then arose from the grave on the morning of the third day Sunday. The evening and the morning times three... perfect. This is the three days and three nights sign of Jonah perfectly fulfilled.
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