I'm A Good Man--most of the time!

[Robert]

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archierieus said:

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Robert said:

Surgery to cure the cancer, right? Yes...and that surgery took place when Christ assumed "our cancer" when He assumed us some 2000 years ago.

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The power of the gospel is here and now, manifested in our lives, making us a "new creation in Christ Jesus."

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What we experience now doesn't contradict what happened 2000 years ago!

As to your quote, "a new creation in Christ Jesus"...let's look at the CONTEXT:

• 2 Corinthians 5:14 "For the love of Christ controls us, having concluded this, that One died for all, therefore [:"Red"]all died[/]; 15 And he died for all, that those who live might live no longer for themselves but for him who for their sake died and was raised.

  16 Therefore from now on we recognize no man according to the flesh [sarx -- "his sinful, human life"]; even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer.

  17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, [some things are become new? No...behold] all things are become new. 18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

Verse 14 establishes the context: One [Jesus as man] died for all, therefore all died!

When did our corporate life die? Right...2000 years ago. So this is definitely talking about the truth as it is "in Christ" or the gospel.

Verse 15 speaks of our gratitude....We desire to live for Christ because of His selfless love towards us.

Now verse 16: Therefore from now on we recognize no man according to the flesh [sarx]

Why "no man"? Again because of the truth as it is "in Christ" Paul recognized "no man" [both believers and unbelievers] according to their sinful, human life.

No, the good news of the gospel is that "all men" are sitting in heavenly places "in Christ Jesus".

"even though we have known Christ according to the flesh, yet now we know Him thus no longer."

The humanity that Christ assumed was our sinful, fallen humanity indwelt by sin. Upon His resurrection Christ left our old man [our old life] in the grave. In its place He took a glorified humanity to heaven. Hence Paul no longer recognized Christ as man, but rather as a glorified man no longer according to the flesh.

Verse 17: Therefore if any man be in Christ....

Paul already recognized "no man" according to his fallen condition, but what he was "in Christ"....The "if" is to the extent that humanity realizes the connection. Through the gospel we are to tell the world that Christ has already saved the human race "in Himself."

Again, "Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new."

Is Paul referring to our sanctification? No...the context clearly points to the truth as it is "in Christ". Proof? Okay:

The only change that has taken place in the believer is in the mind/heart! The flesh remains 100% sinful. Also, we are still mortal...we are still falling short of God's selflessness. So "in us" ALL THINGS have not become new.

The only place in which "ALL things are become new" is in the holy history of Christ!

Verse 18 "And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us [the human race] to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us [believers] the ministry of reconciliation.....

Rob

[Robert]

[Robert]

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Gerry Cabalo said:

God's new creation starts here & now (2 Cor 5:17, Jn 3:5-7), which is crowned with glory at the Second Coming.

Gerry

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No Gerry...that's legalism! That's Traditional Adventism that belittles the cross.

We are already sitting in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus [Eph 2:6; Col 1:13,14] Anything that occurs here is only a reflection of what is true of us "in Him"!

Anything experienced here is to draw others to Christ....It does not contribute one iota to our salvation which is "in Christ". In Him we are complete now and in the judgment.

Perfection through our own good works we can never attain. The soul who sees Jesus by faith, repudiates his own righteousness. He sees himself as incomplete [imperfect], his repentance insufficient, his strongest faith but feebleness, his most costly sacrifice as meager [i.e., his good deeds], and he sinks in humility at the foot of the cross. But a voice speaks to him from the oracles of God's Word. In amazement he hears the message, "Ye are complete in Him." Now all is at rest in his soul. No longer must he strive to find some worthiness in himself, some meritorious deed by which to gain the favor of God. [FW 107]

[Robert]

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Robert said:

We are already sitting in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus [Eph 2:6; Col 1:13,14]

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Even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus

For He delivered us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

[Robert]

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Robert,

I buy your logic.

yongttay

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[archierieus]

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Robert said:

No Gerry...that's legalism! That's Traditional Adventism that belittles the cross.

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Not in the slightest. Actually, it is quite the opposite. The efficacy of the cross is demonstrated in the changed lives of believers. Without that, the gospel is impotent.

I perceive, Robert, that you are focusing on one aspect of the gospel--the component which is outside the believer. For decades, that was characteristic of evangelical theology. Within the last couple of decades, however, we have seen many of the evangelicals discover the importance of obeying God and building character. Now, many of them are climbing onto the platform of Bible truth, to take the place of disillusioned, 'burnt-out' Adventists who are stepping off the platform. Why burned-out? Because they tried to do it on their own.

Thus, we see the two prongs of the omega: two last-day manifestations of the serpent's lie, "Ye shall be as gods." The one group thinks they can do it on their own, by their own power. Legalists through and through. They have not surrendered the heart, or the will, to the Lordship of Jesus Christ.

The other group acknowledges that they can't do it on their own, but then they go a step beyond, and assert that it doesn't matter anyway, that Jesus did a perfect job of it, and that is all that is needed. Thus, they, too, rely on a legal concept of salvation, outside of the believer. Just like the first class of legalists, they keep God at a distance, on the outside. They stay in control. Once again, self-supremacy: "Ye shall be as gods."

I must say, Robert, in reading your quotations from Scripture as well as SOP, you tend to select excerpts which, taken alone, at times appear to support your position. However, you leave out other verses in the passages, and other statements, which provide balance. Even in some of those quotes, there is balance which, however, you do not comment on. For example, your quotation from the SOP, in your most recent post, about "Ye are complete in Him." Take a careful look at the rest of the article, and see what kind of person those words are spoken to.

This is a typical example of something which seems endemic to hard-shell Adventists. Come armed with an arsenal of quotes to hurl at your opponent, rather than do what Jesus did, and ask, "How readest thou?" The mere fact of doing so bears witness, as Jesus said, "By their fruits, ye shall know them."

The bottom-line, Robert, is that your theory of the gospel is legalism through and through, because it keeps Jesus at a distance, and seeks to claim the benefits of salvation, while retaining self-will and self-supremacy.

I really don't see a lot of value in taking the time to carefully analyze your quotes, and point out to you specifics, because I perceive that you welcome conflict, and would then assemble a larger array of quotes, which, of course, could also be addressed, but a huge amount of time and effort would be required, which could be expended on those who are more inclined to listen.

Sincerely, Dave

[LifeHiscost]

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archierieus said:

The bottom-line,..., is that your theory of the gospel is legalism through and through, because it keeps Jesus at a distance, and seeks to claim the benefits of salvation, while retaining self-will and self-supremacy.

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Succinctly, bingo! Your reasoning was so well put, I read it with interest all the way through. While I had arrived at the same conclusion long ago, I couldn't seem to put it together in a way that I felt would adequately inform. I cannot see, whether openly confessed or not, anything but the guidance of the Holy Spirit.

I'm hoping that those who read it will claim the promise,

[:"red"] "And thine ears shall hear a word behind thee, saying, This is the way, walk ye in it" [/]

Isaiah 30:21 KJV

[:"red"] "[Not in your own strength] for it is God Who is all the while effectually at work in you [energizing and creating in you the power and desire], both to will and to work for His good pleasure and satisfaction and delight. " [/] Philippians 2:13 AMP

Keep the faith!

[Robert]

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archierieus said:

The efficacy of the cross is demonstrated in the changed lives of believers. Without that, the gospel is impotent.

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You need a reality check. "A changed life" doesn't equal a "blameless life"....Who are you kidding? Not me...and surely not God. You are still stuck on perfection. I suggest that you are already "perfect" in Christ, but it seems this is not good enough for you. In your self-righteousness you must add to what has already been accomplished. You are a legalist, no doubt about it.

In the end Dave do you think that you will enter heaven by your goodness? No, then let me make a suggestion...accept the gospel, otherwise you'll have stand before the law own your on merits.

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you leave out other verses in the passages, and other statements, which provide balance.

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Balance?...like we are saved partially by our good works and paritally by what Christ did some 2000 years ago? I don't think so....Balance to you means FATIH + WORKS....You can't stand it that little old Dave will not receive a trophy when he enters the gate....

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I really don't see a lot of value in taking the time to carefully analyze your quotes

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Because you can't Dave....Here, try this one:

Let's see what Mrs. Ellen G. White has to say:

• "The religious services, the prayers, the praise, the penitent confession of sin ascend from true believers as incense to the heavenly sanctuary..."

Are these "true believers" measuring up?

• "but passing through the corrupt channels of humanity they are so defiled that unless purified by blood, they can never be of value with God."

Wait just a mintue, Ellen! Are you saying that my prayers, my praise and confession of sin are so defiled that Christ has to purify these things with His own righteousness?

• "They ascend not in spotless purity, and unless the Intercessor, who is at God’s right hand, [:"red"]presents and purifies all by His righteousness[:"black"], it is not acceptable to God."

Yes...you are saying that!

• "All incense from earthly tabernacles [i.e., true believers] must be moist with the cleansing drops of the blood of Christ [i.e., His righteousness]. He holds before the Father the censer of His own merits, [:"red"]in which there is no taint of earthly corruption [self-seeking?][:"black"]. He gathers into this censer the prayers, the praise, and the confessions of His people, and with these He puts His own spotless righteousness. Then, perfumed with the merits of Christ’s propitiation, the incense comes up before God wholly and entirely acceptable. Then gracious answers are returned."

Well...let's get real...Ellen is only writing about a "religious service" - you know - prayers, praise, the confession of sin. Surely she doesn't have our law keeping in mind?

• "Oh, that all may see that everything [:"red"]in obedience[/], in penitence, in praise and thanksgiving, must be placed upon the glowing fire of the righteousness of Christ. The fragrance of this righteousness ascends like a cloud around the mercy seat." [1SM 344]

No...not my "obedience"! It can't be! Do you mean, Ellen, that the Apostle Paul is actually right when he says, "All have sinned [:"red"]AND FALL SHORT OF THE GLORY OF GOD"?[:"black"] Tell me you are kidding!

[Robert]

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LifeHiscost said:

Succinctly, bingo! Your reasoning was so well put

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No it wasn't....

[Stan]

I just put a Sermon geared for training Global Evangelists, on the web, it is about 30 minutes.

This is done by Robert Folkenberg, and he clearly deals with the contradictory statements in the New Testament on this topic.

When I show this DVD at the seminars I do, I can see "light bulbs" going off in peoples heads. Most people say that this is the best sermon they have EVER heard.

It is well worth the investment of time to view this.

Streaming Video, must have quicktime viewer, a free program from www.quicktime.com

Stan

http://homepage.mac.com/stanjensen/iMovieTheater15.html

[Gerr]

Complete in Him while rotting in the cancer of sin? The Christ you preach died 2000 yrs ago & never rose from the grave, my friend. He is still dead and powerless.

Gerry

[Gerr]

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Robert said:

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Robert said:

We are already sitting in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus [Eph 2:6; Col 1:13,14]

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Even when we were dead in our transgressions, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus

For He delivered us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

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[:"blue"]Please, ponder your quote. "For He delivered us from the domain of darkness, and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son...." Can any sane person say they have been delivered from the kingdom of darkness while doing the works of darkness? Can any sane person say they have been transferred to the kingdom of His beloved Son while doing unloving things?

[:"red"]"Destruction is certain for those who say that evil is good and good is evil; that dark is light and light is dark; that bitter is sweet and sweet is bitter." Isa 5:20 NLT [/] [/]

Gerry

[archierieus]

Here is a pattern which I have consistently observed in your posts, Robert. WHENEVER anyone talks about living the new life in Christ, or the fruits of the Spirit, or sanctification, etc., etc., you ALWAYS--without exception--fire back with something like, "Do you live a perfectly selfless life all the time?" Or, "do you ever commmit sin," etc. [These are only representative statements. I haven't taken the time to get exact quotes from your posts. but, I think the substance is correct.]

What I see, is that you are focusing on PERFECTION, and the issue of attaining perfection. That is NOT my issue, and I don't perceive it to be the issue of others who post on this forum. What I am excited about is not the technical issue of what my final state will be, or the semantical issues of what is meant by 'perfection.' I perceive that whole debate to be one for the Pharisees and the Sadduccees to throw back and forth, in their INTERMINABLE arguments!!!

What I am excited about is the personal experience of knowing the Lord Jesus Christ, and the changes I have seen in my life, through knowing Jesus. JESUS HAS MADE A DIFFERENCE IN MY LIFE!!! That is something to get excited about!

What will be the final state of those who continue to abide in Christ? For an answer, I point you to 1 John 3:2:

" Beloved, now we are children of God; and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is."

I would say, let Jesus deal with my final condition. MY focus will be the wonderful experience of knowing the Lord Jesus Christ as my personal Savior, my Friend, my Defender, and my Lord, each day. I have complete confidence in Him, that He will work with me, to make me whatever it is I need to be.

I have also noticed your frequent statements about how awful Christians are whom you have observed. I perceive a perspective there. Without a doubt, all of us have faults. But, Robert, there is GOOD in most people--a lot of good. Why not try looking for the good things in those you observe, and make an effort to affirm and encourage the good things? I think that Jesus does that with us, thank the Lord!!

Once again, I invite you to take your eyes off of your own imperfections and shortcoming, off of the imperfections and shortcomings of others, and turn your eyes upon the Lord Jesus Christ. Focusing on Jesus can really help a person have healthy perspectives, and rejoice in the Lord, and in His saving grace.

Sincerely, Dave

[Gerr]

"There is no evidence of genuine repentance, unless it works reformation." SC 27

"The loveliness of the character of Christ will be seen in His followers..........Love is of God. The unconsecrated heart cannot originate or produce it. It is found only in the heart where Jesus reigns. 'We love Him because He first love us.' 1 Jn 4:19. In the heart renewed by divine grace, love is the principle of action. It modifies the character, governs the impulses, controls the passions, subdues enmity, and ennobles the affections....

There are two errors against which the children of God - particularly those who have just come to trust in His grace - especially need to guard. The first, already dwelt upon, is that of looking to their own works, trusting to anything they can do, to bring themselves into harmony with God. He who is trying to become holy by his own works in keeping the law, is attempting an impossibility. All that man can do without Christ is polluted with selfishness and sin. It is the grace of Christ alone, through faith, that can make us holy.

The opposite and no less dangerous error is, that belief in Christ releases men from keeping the law of God; that since by faith alone we become partakers of the grace of Christ, our works have nothing to do with our redemption......

That so-called faith in Christ which professes to release men from the obligation of obedience to God, is not faith, but presumption." Ibid SC 27-29

Gerry

[Robert]

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Gerry Cabalo said:

For He delivered us from the domain of darkness,

and transferred us to the kingdom of His beloved Son

, in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.

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Can any sane person say they have been delivered from the kingdom of darkness while doing the works of darkness?

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Gerry you missed the whole point! Please look at my quote again: He, God, transferred us....That is a past tense historical event. He transferred us from this world [i.e., "the domain of darkness"] to where? "the kingdom of His beloved Son"!

I noticed you left out Eph 2:5,6:

5 even when we were dead in our transgressions [sinners], made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up with Him, and seated us with Him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus....

You twisted this completely out of context! You'll do anything, lie, manipulate, etc, to add your works program back into the equation of salvation. Please, from now on, be honest with the context.

[Robert]

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Gerry Cabalo said:

That so-called faith in Christ which professes to release men from the obligation of obedience to God, is not faith, but

presumption

." Ibid SC 27-29

Gerry

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Please explain this:

• "The religious services, the prayers, the praise, the penitent confession of sin ascend from true believers as incense to the heavenly sanctuary, but passing through the corrupt channels of humanity they are so defiled that unless purified by blood, they can never be of value with God.They ascend not in spotless purity, and unless the Intercessor, who is at God’s right hand, [:"red"]presents and purifies all by His righteousness[:"black"], it is not acceptable to God."

  All incense from earthly tabernacles [i.e., true believers] must be moist with the cleansing drops of the blood of Christ [i.e., His righteousness]. He holds before the Father the censer of His own merits, [:"red"]in which there is no taint of earthly corruption [:"black"]. He gathers into this censer the prayers, the praise, and the confessions of His people, and with these He puts His own spotless righteousness. Then, perfumed with the merits of Christ’s propitiation, the incense comes up before God wholly and entirely acceptable. Then gracious answers are returned.

  "Oh, that all may see that everything [:"red"]in obedience[/], in penitence, in praise and thanksgiving, must be placed upon the glowing fire of the righteousness of Christ. The fragrance of this righteousness ascends like a cloud around the mercy seat." [1SM 344]

[Gerr]

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Robert said:

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Gerry Cabalo said:

That so-called faith in Christ which professes to release men from the obligation of obedience to God, is not faith, but

presumption

." Ibid SC 27-29

Gerry

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Please explain this:

• "The religious services, the prayers, the praise, the penitent confession of sin ascend from true believers as incense to the heavenly sanctuary, but passing through the corrupt channels of humanity they are so defiled that unless purified by blood, they can never be of value with God.They ascend not in spotless purity, and unless the Intercessor, who is at God’s right hand, [:"red"]presents and purifies all by His righteousness[:"black"], it is not acceptable to God."

  All incense from earthly tabernacles [i.e., true believers] must be moist with the cleansing drops of the blood of Christ [i.e., His righteousness]. He holds before the Father the censer of His own merits, [:"red"]in which there is no taint of earthly corruption [:"black"]. He gathers into this censer the prayers, the praise, and the confessions of His people, and with these He puts His own spotless righteousness. Then, perfumed with the merits of Christ’s propitiation, the incense comes up before God wholly and entirely acceptable. Then gracious answers are returned.

  "Oh, that all may see that everything [:"red"]in obedience[/], in penitence, in praise and thanksgiving, must be placed upon the glowing fire of the righteousness of Christ. The fragrance of this righteousness ascends like a cloud around the mercy seat." [1SM 344]

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[:"blue"]Since you conveniently just quote EGW to back up your erroneous position but ignore her other statements, let her do the explaining.

[:"red"]But notice here that obedience is not a mere outward compliance, but the service of love. The law of God is an expression of His very nature; it is an embodiment of the great principle of love, and hence is the foundation of His government in heaven and earth. If our hearts are renewed in the likeness of God, kif the divine love is implanted in the soul, will not the law of God be carried out in the life" When the principle of love is implanted in the heart, when man is renewed after the image of Him that created him, the new-covenant promise is fulfilled, "I will put My laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them." Heb 10:16. And if the law is written in the heart, will it not shape the life? Obedience - the service and allegiance of love - is the true sign of discipleship. Thus the Scripture says, "This is the love of God, that we keep His commandments." "He that saith, I know Him, and keepeth not His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in Him." ! Jn 5:3; 2:4. Instead of releasing man from obedience, it is faith, and faith only, that makes us partakers of the grace of Christ, which enables us to render obedience."

We do not earn salvation by our obedience; for salvation is the free gift of God, to be received by faith. But obedience is the fruit of faith. "Ye know that He was manifested to take away our sins; and in Him is no sin. Whosoever abideth in Him sinneth not; whosoever sinneth hath not seen Him, neither known Him." 1 Jn 3:5,6. Here is the true test. If we abide in Christ, if the love of God dwells in us, our feelings, our thoughts, our purposes, our actions, will be in harmony with the will of God as expressed in the precepts of His holy law. "Little children let no man deceive you; he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as He is righteous." 1 Jn 3:7. Righteousness is defined by the standard of God's holy law, as expressed in the ten precepts given on Sinai.

That so-called faith in Christ which professes to release men from the obligation of obedience to God, is not faith, but presumption. SC 60-61 [/] [/]

Gerry

[archierieus]

I think that both Gerry and Rob have some excellent points. Rob is right on the money when he affirms that our salvation is based upon the completed, perfect work of Christ on the cross. Gerry is right on the money when he points out that the gospel of Jesus Christ changes a person, makes him or her a better person, a new creation in Christ Jesus. These are two facets of the everlasting gospel, and they are inseparable. They go together. Any attempt to separate them, is artificial and can lead to confusion. To say that we can get to heaven, based on our works, is false doctrine. To say that we can get to heaven, regardless of our works, is false doctrine.

It also looks to me like there may be an element of personal conflict on these threads, which can derail the discussion and detract from the good which may be accomplished. I suggest that both sides seek common ground, for there is a lot to agree upon.

Regards, Dave

[Clio]

Seems to me that even though Dr. Ben is no longer using this thread he started, it might be better to take the on-going debate with Robert to it's own thread....

Doc, I'm sorry if I've contributed in any way to the hi-jacking of your thread.

[archierieus]

Actually, I think that what has been brought out on this thread goes right to the heart of the question. After our prayer fellowship tonight, I would like to summarize some of those important points.

Regards, Dave

[archierieus]

Now, I should like to briefly summarize what I have observed on this thread, which is on point to what Ben posted. Firstly, of course, his query, which was essentially, 'I am a good, basically law-abiding citizen. I believe in Jesus as my Savior, but fall short of the mark in various ways. But, basically, I am a good person. Will I be saved?'

Several things have been posted in response. I wish to select a few of those items, in the general order in which they were posted.

1) God knows your heart, and He can be trusted to do what is best in regard to your 'fate.'

2) Surrender your life to the Lordship of Jesus Christ. Place your all on the altar, and accept Christ's Lordship in every area of your life, so that you can say from your heart, "Not my will, but Thine be done."

3) Someone who loves Jesus will come to hate sin and renounce sin in his or her life. Such a person will neither excuse sin nor be comfortable with it.

4) Salvation is based upon the completed, perfect work which Jesus Christ accomplished on the cross.

5) The gospel of Jesus Christ results in the transformation of the believer.

6) We do not know what we shall be when Jesus returns, but we do know that we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. (1 John 3:2)

7) As we stay in communion with Jesus, and cooperate with His working in our lives, we can trust Him to do whatever is needed for our preparation for His return.

Regards, Dave

[LifeHiscost]

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archierieus said:

To say that we can get to heaven, regardless of >>our works<<, is false doctrine.

Dave

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Dave,

The rub comes in when we think it as >>our works<<, seen as either inhibiting or facilitating entrance into the kingdom.

[:"blue"] "Only the covering which Christ Himself has provided can make us meet to appear in God's presence. This covering, the robe of His own righteousness, Christ will put upon every repenting, believing soul. "I counsel thee," He says, "to buy of Me . . . white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear." Rev. 3:18.

This robe, woven in the loom of heaven, has in it not one thread of human devising. Christ in His humanity wrought out a perfect character, and this character He offers to impart to us. "All our righteousness are as filthy rags." Isa. 64:6. Everything that we of ourselves can do is defiled by sin." [/]

Christ's Object Lessons, page 311, paragraph 4

Chapter Title: Without a Wedding Garment

[:"red"] " so Christ was offered once to bear the sins of many. To those who eagerly wait for Him He will appear a second time, apart from sin, for salvation." [/]

Heb 9:28 NKJV

Keep the faith!

[Robert]

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archierieus said:

3) Someone who loves Jesus will come to hate sin and renounce sin in his or her life. Such a person will neither excuse sin nor be comfortable with it.

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As Nico said...that's a state of mind/heart! It's an attitude, but you can't always equate "attitude" with performance. See Romans 7:22,23/Romans 3:23.

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6) We do not know what we shall be when Jesus returns, but we do know that we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. (1 John 3:2)

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Why will we be like Him?

1 Cor 15:51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, 52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. 53 For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.

More later...

Rob

[Gerr]

The good works in the believer's life is NOT man's works. It is the work of God with the the cooperation of the believer.

"Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling; for it is God who works in you both to will to do for His good pleasure." Phil 2:13 NKJ, wrought out by "Him who is able to do exceedingly abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that works in us, to Him be glory in the church by Christ Jesus to all generations, forever and ever. Amen." Eph 3:20,21 NKJ.

"...and that you put on the new man which was created according to God, in true righteousness & holiness." Eph 4:24 NKJ.

The receiving of righteousness from God whether it be the righteousness of God received in justification or sanctification, is received through faith alone.

Gerry

[Gerr]

The change in the believer does NOT begin at the second coming. The new birth takes place the moment a sinner puts his trust in the One who shed His blood to save him. Death to sin, crucifixion of the old man is symbolized by the burial under water at baptism, and the beginning of the new life is symbolized by the rising from the watery grave, Rom 6. "Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation; old things have passed away; behold, all things have become new." 2 Cor 5:17 NKJ. The only thing not new is his physical body; this will be changed at the Second Coming when he receives immortality.

Anyone waiting to be miraculously changed in character at the Second Coming will have a very shocking awakening.

Gerry