What do you call yourself . . .

[John317]

God in Deut. 4:13 could not be more clear, yet you still maintain that what the SDA church teaches on this supercedes Scripture, at least that is how it appears.

Deut. 4: 13 doesn't teach that the Ten Commandments are the covenant. It teaches that the Ten Commandments are the basis of the covenant.

Quote:

Exodus 24:7 And he took the book of the covenant, and read in the audience of the people: and they said, All that the LORD hath said will we do, and be obedient.

24:8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled [it] on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

NOTE: The Lord made an agreement with the people of Israel "concerning" the words of the law.

Check out Exodus 19: 5-9.

What does that say?

Quote:

19:4 Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and [how] I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself.

19:5 Now therefore, if ye will obey my voice indeed, and keep my covenant, then ye shall be a peculiar treasure unto me above all people: for all the earth [is] mine:

19:6 And ye shall be unto me a kingdom of priests, and an holy nation. These [are] the words which thou shalt speak unto the children of Israel.

19:7 And Moses came and called for the elders of the people, and laid before their faces all these words which the LORD commanded him.

19:8 And all the people answered together, and said, All that the LORD hath spoken we will do. And Moses returned the words of the people unto the LORD.

19:9 And the LORD said unto Moses, Lo, I come unto thee in a thick cloud, that the people may hear when I speak with thee, and believe thee for ever. And Moses told the words of the people unto the LORD.

[miz3]

Originally Posted By: miz3

I was expressing my opinion that it is a fact! I am allowed to express my opinion about what is fact or not fact!

Anyone can express an opinion, but an opinion is only as good as the evidence and the reasoning that support it.

On the Adventist Forum, when people express those kinds of opinions, they should expect to be asked for evidence.

What is your evidence that it is a fact?

Why are to trying to trap me? Are you looking for an excuse to punish me?

[John317]

I'm merely trying to find out what you believe your evidence is.

Remember not to try to read people's minds or motives. All we have are people's written words to go by. We can't hear the tone of their voice or see the expression on their face, so people can often be wrong about others if they try to read their motives.

[John317]

Quote:

Hebrews 8:7 For if that first [covenant] had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.

8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:

8:9 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

8:10 For this [is] the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, saith the Lord; I will put my laws into their mind, and write them in their hearts: and I will be to them a God, and they shall be to me a people:

8:11 And they shall not teach every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the Lord: for all shall know me, from the least to the greatest.

8:12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more.

8:13 In that he saith, A new [covenant], he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old [is] ready to vanish away.

How many covenants have there been, according to these verses?

What does verse 13 say is happening to the first, or old, covenant?

Is this what's happening to the Ten Commandments?

[John317]

...God in Deut. 4:13 could not be more clear, yet you still maintain that what the SDA church teaches on this supercedes Scripture, at least that is how it appears.

No, I am not saying that the SDA teaching on this supercedes the Scripture. I am saying that the SDA teaching is identical to the Bible's teaching. The authority of the Bible takes precedence over everything. All church doctrines must be judged by the Bible.

You're misunderstanding what the Bible says about the covenants, which is why you reject the concept of the Old and the New Covenants.

Quote:

Beyond the inner veil was the holy of holies, where centered the symbolic service of atonement and intercession, and which formed the connecting link between heaven and earth. In this apartment was the ark, a chest of acacia wood, overlaid within and without with gold, and having a crown of gold about the top. It was made as a depository for the tables of stone, upon which God Himself had inscribed the Ten Commandments. Hence it was called the ark of God's testament, or the ark of the covenant, since the Ten Commandments were the basis of the covenant made between God and Israel. {PP 348.2}

[shelly]

Originally Posted By: shelly

... The bible states that we will no longer need to go to our neighbor and ask them to teach us of the Lord. If that is true, why do we need someone else to reveal God's word to us?

The gift of prophecy is one of the marks of identity of God's last-day people who give the Three Angels Messages of Rev. 14: 6-11.

Notice the instruction of the Holy Spirit in the following verses:

1 Thess. 5:19 Quench not the Spirit.

5:20 Despise not prophesyings.

5:21 Prove all things; hold fast that which is good.

I believe in the gift of prophesy. I just don't believe that EGW is the gift of prophecy for this last day. I believe that many in the last day will recieve guidence from God. I do not believe that it is rolled up into one prophet. But we are so conditioned to read the Word using EGW glasses with the assumption that she is right and she is supported by the bible that we will force the bible to support her statements. I had one woman argue me down in Sabbath School that Adam and Eve were not naked in the Garden because Sister White said they were surrounded by a white light. Even when pushed she refused to admit that there was nudity in the garden. While the differences in reports does not change the core meaning of the event it does deviate from the biblical account. It is little things like that which have added up for me over the years. Little inconsistancies that don't quite fit but do not seem to change the whole. But their are too many small "corrections" to the way the gospel is reported that make me uncomfortable. It is a personal issue- why did EGW need to go back and add "details" to events already recorded in the bible. Why do her details add little pieces of information that slightly alter the facts of the bible? How many littles changes have been made until the view of what happened biblically is altered in the minds of her readers? You can slightly alter a picture repeatedly until the picture becomes distorted. I am unsure if this is what is happening with using EGW as an authoritive voice in our church. This is what I am struggling with.

[Lysimachus]

I believe in the gift of prophesy. I just don't believe that EGW is the gift of prophecy for this last day. I believe that many in the last day will recieve guidence from God. I do not believe that it is rolled up into one prophet. But we are so conditioned to read the Word using EGW glasses with the assumption that she is right and she is supported by the bible that we will force the bible to support her statements. I had one woman argue me down in Sabbath School that Adam and Eve were not naked in the Garden because Sister White said they were surrounded by a white light. Even when pushed she refused to admit that there was nudity in the garden. While the differences in reports does not change the core meaning of the event it does deviate from the biblical account. It is little things like that which have added up for me over the years. Little inconsistancies that don't quite fit but do not seem to change the whole. But their are too many small "corrections" to the way the gospel is reported that make me uncomfortable. It is a personal issue- why did EGW need to go back and add "details" to events already recorded in the bible. Why do her details add little pieces of information that slightly alter the facts of the bible? How many littles changes have been made until the view of what happened biblically is altered in the minds of her readers? You can slightly alter a picture repeatedly until the picture becomes distorted. I am unsure if this is what is happening with using EGW as an authoritive voice in our church. This is what I am struggling with.

No offense Shelly, but usually when people begin to find something wrong with the writings of Ellen White, it is because deep down inside they are cherishing idols that they are unwilling to give up, and do not want to do what is right fully and completely like they think they do. We have found this trend over and over again, and many such individuals ended up leaving Christianity altogether.

I know a lady and her clan who were shown about all the "inconsistencies in Ellen White's writings", and her "false predictions", and she began to conclude that the "evidence is overwhelming". This guy we knew was the one who ended up showing her. To make a long story short, after years went buy, he ended up giving up the Bible and Christianity and began to entertain Middle Eastern religions. The lady and her clan ended up giving up Adventism altogether, and well, now is nothing...doesn't really care to live a Christian lifestyle anymore, and they've all departed from Christian living period, not just Adventism.

Ellen White warns about those who begin to cherish doubts for the testimonies, that many end up giving up the Bible in the end. I see it happening before my very eyes over and over and over again.

You Shelly and whoever you are joined with are on dangerous ground. You will probably respond to this and give a million reasons why I'm wrong and I don't understand where you're coming from, but to be quite frank, I've heard it all. And all the reasons in the world are not going to impress me.

Nobody is suggesting that the Spirit of God cannot work on the minds of people, or that all inspiration is wrapped up in a single prophet. However, when God calls a prophet, you can be sure that when the Spirit leads individuals, the convictions that lead those people will BE IN HARMONY with the prophet! They will not conflict! If they conflict, you better re-evaluate yourself and find out if maybe those "so called inspired thoughts" that came to you are from God or the Devil.

Yes, they may be from the Devil. The Devil whispers "bright ideas" in our minds that seem "so Spiritual", but it is a counterfeit. Satan is crafty and subtle like that.

We're not here to play games. We either accept the Adventist message along with Ellen White or we don't. You're either in or your out. You cannot be "partly Adventist", by keeping the Sabbath, believing that the Papacy is the Antichrist, or believing in the 2300 days/years as ending in 1844, and yet choose to not believe in the inspired writings of Ellen White. There's no in-between. Had it not been for Ellen White, none of these ideologies would have been held together. The Advent movement would have split off in a thousand splinter groups. God sent her just on time to comfort the disenchanted believers, and help keep them together.

You're either fully for us, or you're with the False Prophet and all his ideologies. You might as well become a Dispensational Futurist, and kiss up to the sun-dial dreaming, hermetic-dragon, church-father quoting quarter truth artists that make a good show of circus-ride amusement theology, filled to the brim with semantic jugglery!

Time is too short to be entertaining doubts about Ellen White or the central tenants of our faith. To entertain such doubts are not thoughts from God, but they are thoughts from Satan. The Devil. The great Hermetic Dragon who was cast out of Heaven for entertaining doubts about God.

If you do not change these thoughts that you are entertaining, I predict that when the great trial comes upon the whole earth, and the Sabbath/Sunday test comes into full play, you WILL yield, and will not have the necessary faith to stand up for truth and righteousness, and will end up siding with the enemy. It IS INEVITABLE. Mark my words.

Pray earnestly so that you may escape the great delusions that are about to sweep the whole globe. To ignore Ellen White's warnings and counsels is to prepare yourself to be put to sleep by the deadly and poisoning miasma the Serpent is soon to breathe upon the whole world.

[John317]

...I had one woman argue me down in Sabbath School that Adam and Eve were not naked in the Garden because Sister White said they were surrounded by a white light. Even when pushed she refused to admit that there was nudity in the garden. While the differences in reports does not change the core meaning of the event it does deviate from the biblical account. It is little things like that which have added up for me over the years. Little inconsistancies that don't quite fit but do not seem to change the whole.

Of course Adam and Eve were naked in the Garden. The Bible is very clear about that. God did not make them with clothes on.

However, Ellen White's statements about the "light" surrounding them doesn't contradict what the Bible teaches. She herself says they were naked:

Quote:

Adam and Eve both ate of the fruit, and obtained a knowledge which, had they obeyed God, they would never have had, --an experience in disobedience and disloyalty to God,--the knowledge that they were naked. The garment of innocence, a covering from God, which surrounded them, departed; and they supplied the place of this heavenly garment by sewing together fig-leaves for aprons. {CC 17.2}

But the great Lawgiver was about to make known to Adam and Eve the consequences of their transgression. The divine presence was manifested in the garden. In their innocence and holiness they had joyfully welcomed the approach of their Creator; but now they fled in terror, and sought to hide in the deepest recesses of the garden. But "the Lord God called unto Adam, and said unto him, Where art thou? And he said, I heard Thy voice in the garden, and I was afraid, because I was naked; and I hid myself. And He said, Who told thee that thou wast naked? Hast thou eaten of the tree, whereof I commanded thee that thou shouldest not eat?" {PP 57.4}

Ellen White isn't denying or contradicting what the Bible says. She is saying, as the Bible itself says, that although Adam and Eve were naked, they weren't self-conscious of being naked until they sinned. They had no shame in their nakedness until after the Fall.

[John317]

Don't judge Ellen White by what that woman or by what other people tell you. That would be like judging the Bible by what someone says. Judge both the Bible and Ellen White on the basis of your own personal, prayerful study.

Everyone must decide these things for themselves in their own mind after study and reflection.

As you study her writings,-- such as the Desire of Ages, Steps To Christ, and the Testimonies-- see if her books lead you to the study of the Bible and closer to Christ or if they lead you away from the Bible and further from Christ.

[teresaq]

This last sentence of yours indicates to me that the last thing you need for any of us to do is to come along and "preachy/teachy" you. You are more looking to be heard and understood. Am I correct?

Having said that I would like to share, if that would be permissible, how I reconcile the two, which do seem contradictory, at least in the particular points you brought up here.

Far too often we seem to get caught up in defending the church, EGW, or God that we are not able to address legitimate concerns such as you have expressed.

Originally Posted By: shelly

... The bible states that we will no longer need to go to our neighbor and ask them to teach us of the Lord. If that is true, why do we need someone else to reveal God's word to us?

I believe in the gift of prophesy. I just don't believe that EGW is the gift of prophecy for this last day. I believe that many in the last day will recieve guidence from God. I do not believe that it is rolled up into one prophet. But we are so conditioned to read the Word using EGW glasses with the assumption that she is right and she is supported by the bible that we will force the bible to support her statements. I had one woman argue me down in Sabbath School that Adam and Eve were not naked in the Garden because Sister White said they were surrounded by a white light. Even when pushed she refused to admit that there was nudity in the garden. ... I am unsure if this is what is happening with using EGW as an authoritive voice in our church. This is what I am struggling with.

[Lysimachus]

Very well said John317. There is no "inconsistency" whatsoever. The Devil plants the idea in their minds that such an "inconsistency" exists simply because deep in their hearts they WANT there to be an inconsistency, because they really don't want to have to obey her counsels. That definitely seems to be the "crux" of the matter.

Oh how we need to closely evaluate our hearts.

[teresaq]

Perhaps we could give the sister the benefit of the doubt instead of judging her. Perhaps she is quite honest in her seeking of the Lord and that these are quite legitimate concerns she has that we can address in a different way instead of insisting that she accept EGW or....

Oh how we need to closely evaluate our hearts.

Yes indeed, we do.

[ClubV12]

Shelly will have to work this our for herself of course, between her and God. Love is also demonstrated in the straight testimony, not tickling someones ears, but the plain truth. Delivered in a spirt of love, but delivered never the less.

At some point every SDA will have to make a decision as it concerns Sister White, I don't see any way around that. At some point in your experience you are going to have to address this, in your heart, your soul. I do hope that questioning is sincere as in one searching for truth as for hidden treasure. God is VERY long suffering, but there is a limit to His mercy as well. If He can't speak to us in blessings received, He will speak to us in blessings removed.

As it concerns Adam and Eve, it's a point that is not paramount to the salvation question when one is struggling to figure out where they stand with the Lord. However, in Sabbath school class, to cite Sister White as a referrence on some point is "fair game". When a quote is offered, in context, that you disagree with, it is best left alone at that. Discuss it after class if you feel the need. Often, as John pointed out, BOTH parties are correct on a given point! Not worth arguing over in class.

Recently there was a BIG discussion over the meaning of the "daily" among the brethren at our church. Such things are best left alone if it leads to division and ill feelings because someone disagrees with a position. Finding the love for and of God will lead to an understanding of those things which are truly important to an individuals salvation.

We need to draw closer to one another and to Christ. PLEASE don't decide to "go it alone" in your theology.

[miz3]

Originally Posted By: shelly

I believe in the gift of prophesy. I just don't believe that EGW is the gift of prophecy for this last day. I believe that many in the last day will recieve guidence from God. I do not believe that it is rolled up into one prophet. But we are so conditioned to read the Word using EGW glasses with the assumption that she is right and she is supported by the bible that we will force the bible to support her statements. I had one woman argue me down in Sabbath School that Adam and Eve were not naked in the Garden because Sister White said they were surrounded by a white light. Even when pushed she refused to admit that there was nudity in the garden. While the differences in reports does not change the core meaning of the event it does deviate from the biblical account. It is little things like that which have added up for me over the years. Little inconsistancies that don't quite fit but do not seem to change the whole. But their are too many small "corrections" to the way the gospel is reported that make me uncomfortable. It is a personal issue- why did EGW need to go back and add "details" to events already recorded in the bible. Why do her details add little pieces of information that slightly alter the facts of the bible? How many littles changes have been made until the view of what happened biblically is altered in the minds of her readers? You can slightly alter a picture repeatedly until the picture becomes distorted. I am unsure if this is what is happening with using EGW as an authoritive voice in our church. This is what I am struggling with.

No offense Shelly, but usually when people begin to find something wrong with the writings of Ellen White, it is because deep down inside they are cherishing idols that they are unwilling to give up, and do not want to do what is right fully and completely like they think they do. We have found this trend over and over again, and many such individuals ended up leaving Christianity altogether.

I know a lady and her clan who were shown about all the "inconsistencies in Ellen White's writings", and her "false predictions", and she began to conclude that the "evidence is overwhelming". This guy we knew was the one who ended up showing her. To make a long story short, after years went buy, he ended up giving up the Bible and Christianity and began to entertain Middle Eastern religions. The lady and her clan ended up giving up Adventism altogether, and well, now is nothing...doesn't really care to live a Christian lifestyle anymore, and they've all departed from Christian living period, not just Adventism.

Ellen White warns about those who begin to cherish doubts for the testimonies, that many end up giving up the Bible in the end. I see it happening before my very eyes over and over and over again.

You Shelly and whoever you are joined with are on dangerous ground. You will probably respond to this and give a million reasons why I'm wrong and I don't understand where you're coming from, but to be quite frank, I've heard it all. And all the reasons in the world are not going to impress me.

Nobody is suggesting that the Spirit of God cannot work on the minds of people, or that all inspiration is wrapped up in a single prophet. However, when God calls a prophet, you can be sure that when the Spirit leads individuals, the convictions that lead those people will BE IN HARMONY with the prophet! They will not conflict! If they conflict, you better re-evaluate yourself and find out if maybe those "so called inspired thoughts" that came to you are from God or the Devil.

Yes, they may be from the Devil. The Devil whispers "bright ideas" in our minds that seem "so Spiritual", but it is a counterfeit. Satan is crafty and subtle like that.

We're not here to play games. We either accept the Adventist message along with Ellen White or we don't. You're either in or your out. You cannot be "partly Adventist", by keeping the Sabbath, believing that the Papacy is the Antichrist, or believing in the 2300 days/years as ending in 1844, and yet choose to not believe in the inspired writings of Ellen White. There's no in-between. Had it not been for Ellen White, none of these ideologies would have been held together. The Advent movement would have split off in a thousand splinter groups. God sent her just on time to comfort the disenchanted believers, and help keep them together.

You're either fully for us, or you're with the False Prophet and all his ideologies. You might as well become a Dispensational Futurist, and kiss up to the sun-dial dreaming, hermetic-dragon, church-father quoting quarter truth artists that make a good show of circus-ride amusement theology, filled to the brim with semantic jugglery!

Time is too short to be entertaining doubts about Ellen White or the central tenants of our faith. To entertain such doubts are not thoughts from God, but they are thoughts from Satan. The Devil. The great Hermetic Dragon who was cast out of Heaven for entertaining doubts about God.

If you do not change these thoughts that you are entertaining, I predict that when the great trial comes upon the whole earth, and the Sabbath/Sunday test comes into full play, you WILL yield, and will not have the necessary faith to stand up for truth and righteousness, and will end up siding with the enemy. It IS INEVITABLE. Mark my words.

Pray earnestly so that you may escape the great delusions that are about to sweep the whole globe. To ignore Ellen White's warnings and counsels is to prepare yourself to be put to sleep by the deadly and poisoning miasma the Serpent is soon to breathe upon the whole world.

Typical SDA scare tactics!

[ClubV12]

Fear God miz3, one of three angels message to be given to the world. Some see it literally as fear, and justifibaly so when they call on the rocks to hide them from His glory. Others see the reverance, adoration and love of God in that message.

Those that do not "fear God" in the correct way, will certainly experience fear, as in raw terror, at the final resurrection. Justice will be served, mercy will be extended, we have a heaven to win and a hell to loose in this life.

[miz3]

Fear God miz3, one of three angels message to be given to the world. Some see it literally as fear, and justifibaly so when they call on the rocks to hide them from His glory. Others see the reverance, adoration and love of God in that message.

Those that do not "fear God" in the correct way, will certainly experience fear, as in raw terror, at the final resurrection. Justice will be served, mercy will be extended, we have a heaven to win and a hell to loose in this life.

SDA SPIN!

[ClubV12]

How foolish to suggest the Lord is not coming again and that all is "peace and safty".

[teresaq]

I believe that our sister's concerns should be acknowledged and addressed instead of insisting one accept EGW on, in this case, blind faith, or making such judgmental statements if they do not. The scriptures do address this issue, in my opinion and we can share that. We need to wait a long, long time before we make a judgment on another, I believe until the 1000 years going over the books if I understand this text correctly, 1Co 4:5 Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts:....

Hmmm, that is another area I need work in.

Shelly will have to work this our for herself of course, between her and God. Love is also demonstrated in the straight testimony, not tickling someones ears, but the plain truth. Delivered in a spirt of love, but delivered never the less.

At some point every SDA will have to make a decision as it concerns Sister White, I don't see any way around that. At some point in your experience you are going to have to address this, in your heart, your soul. I do hope that questioning is sincere as in one searching for truth as for hidden treasure. God is VERY long suffering, but there is a limit to His mercy as well. If He can't speak to us in blessings received, He will speak to us in blessings removed.

As it concerns Adam and Eve, it's a point that is not paramount to the salvation question when one is struggling to figure out where they stand with the Lord. However, in Sabbath school class, to cite Sister White as a referrence on some point is "fair game". When a quote is offered, in context, that you disagree with, it is best left alone at that. Discuss it after class if you feel the need. Often, as John pointed out, BOTH parties are correct on a given point! Not worth arguing over in class.

Recently there was a BIG discussion over the meaning of the "daily" among the brethren at our church. Such things are best left alone if it leads to division and ill feelings because someone disagrees with a position. Finding the love for and of God will lead to an understanding of those things which are truly important to an individuals salvation.

We need to draw closer to one another and to Christ. PLEASE don't decide to "go it alone" in your theology.

[miz3]

How foolish to suggest the Lord is not coming again and that all is "peace and safty".

THE LORD IS COMING AGAIN!

HOWEVER YOU DO NOT KNOW THE DAY OR THE HOUR!

IN FACT YOU DO NOT KNOW HOW CLOSE OR HOW FAR IT IS!

I'M READY! ARE YOU?

[miz3]

Shelly will have to work this our for herself of course, between her and God. Love is also demonstrated in the straight testimony, not tickling someones ears, but the plain truth. Delivered in a spirt of love, but delivered never the less.

At some point every SDA will have to make a decision as it concerns Sister White, I don't see any way around that. At some point in your experience you are going to have to address this, in your heart, your soul. I do hope that questioning is sincere as in one searching for truth as for hidden treasure. God is VERY long suffering, but there is a limit to His mercy as well. If He can't speak to us in blessings received, He will speak to us in blessings removed.

As it concerns Adam and Eve, it's a point that is not paramount to the salvation question when one is struggling to figure out where they stand with the Lord. However, in Sabbath school class, to cite Sister White as a referrence on some point is "fair game". When a quote is offered, in context, that you disagree with, it is best left alone at that. Discuss it after class if you feel the need. Often, as John pointed out, BOTH parties are correct on a given point! Not worth arguing over in class.

Recently there was a BIG discussion over the meaning of the "daily" among the brethren at our church. Such things are best left alone if it leads to division and ill feelings because someone disagrees with a position. Finding the love for and of God will lead to an understanding of those things which are truly important to an individuals salvation.

We need to draw closer to one another and to Christ. PLEASE don't decide to "go it alone" in your theology.

SDA JUDGMENTALISM!

[ClubV12]

teresaq, are you suggesting that Ellen White should NOT be cited or quoted in Sabbath school class? That works well, if your in a BAPTIST church!

It's an SDA church, where Sister White is considered an inspired source of information. The Sabbath school lesson is peppered with her quotes. If you choose to dismiss her work in Sabbath school class, or restrict members from citing her work, you might as well throw out the Sabbath school lesson all together! You don't have to believe her inspired work, but please, don't "fight against" it, in Sabbath school of all places!

[teresaq]

Your post is a misunderstanding of what I am saying.

I believe Shelly's concerns, at least regarding Adam and Eve's nudity, can be addressed biblicaly...I mean, I believe there are specific texts that EGW is basing her statement on which is why we should search the scriptures more.

[ClubV12]

OH, I see what you mean, I think John summed it up nicely in that regard. They WERE naked, AND, they were covered with a robe of light. OK, lets assume you don't believe in the "robe of light". They were naked and knew it not. All though, in Sabbath school class, I wouldn't hesitate to point out, "Sister White says...." That would be entirely appropriate, any given member can accept it, or not. But it's not the time or place to "argue" the point one way or the other.

Are the angels naked?

[John317]

...

SDA JUDGMENTALISM!

Where do you perceive the "SDA Judgmentalism" in Club's post?

[John317]

THE LORD IS COMING AGAIN!

I'M READY! ARE YOU?

What does it mean to be "ready"? Do you mean "ready" to go through the last-day events along with the persecution?

What about the sealing? What must people be like in order to be sealed by the sealing angel?