Where in the Bible is the term "Investigative Judgment"?

[wayfinder]

Well said ClubV12, I would add, it is not just about keeping the law(Ten Commandments) it is practicing and proclaiming the testimony of Jesus.

Revelation 12:17 NAS

So the dragon was enraged with the woman, and went off to make war with the rest of her children, who keep the commandments of God and hold to the testimony of Jesus.

John 18:37 NAS

Therefore Pilate said to Him, "So You are a king ?" Jesus answered, "You say correctly that I am a king. For this I have been born, and for this I have come into the world, to testify to the truth. Everyone who is of the truth hears My voice."

John 3:21 NAS

"But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God."

Salvation is not achieved by keeping the Ten Commandments period, it also requires that we practice the truth. Jesus told Pilate that the reason for His coming to this earth was to testify to the truth, that we would know the truth if we believed and practiced His testimony. The testimony of Jesus is the gospel of the kingdom.

Matthew 4:23 NAS

Jesus was going throughout all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues and proclaiming the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every kind of disease and every kind of sickness among the people.

[John317]

Question: What role does Christ play in my salvation right now? ( from Darlene)

a. Keep in mind that there is salvation only in Jesus Christ. Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved

__(1) This being the case, then Jesus has a major role in your salvation today.

__(2) In the work of salvation, Jesus has three specific active roles to save us.

b. In the first place, while we were sinners what did Christ do for us? Romans 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us

__(1) It is the blood of Christ that cleanses us from all sin. 1 John 1:7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin

____(a) This cleansing makes us just before God. Romans 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him

____( As someone once said: Just as if I’d never sinned.

____© This action, saves us from the wrath of God against sin and those attached to it.

__(2) This death of Christ brings about reconciliation with God. Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son.

__(3) This was the work of Christ as the Lamb of God. John 1:29 The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world

____(a) The pure spotless Lamb. 1 Peter 1:19 But with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot

c. If Christ died for us merely, we would be of all men the most miserable. 1 Corinthians 15:16-19 For if the dead rise not, then is not Christ raised: 17 And if Christ be not raised, your faith is vain; ye are yet in your sins. 18 Then they also which are fallen asleep in Christ are perished. 19 If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable

__(1) But Christ is risen. 1 Corinthians 15:20 But now is Christ risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of them that slept

__(2) Why is the resurrection of Christ so important to us? Romans 5:10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life

____(a) Salvation does not come from a dead Christ but from our Risen Lord.

____( We are born again through the resurrection of Christ. 1 Peter 1:3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, which according to his abundant mercy hath begotten us again unto a lively hope by the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead

__(3) The living Christ has this power. 2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new

Continued

[John317]

Continued

d. After the resurrection, Jesus then had yet another work to do Romans 5:8-11 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him. 10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life. 11 And not only so, but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement

__(1) We read all these verses together so that we can follow the context.

__(2) After His death and resurrection, Christ now is atoning for our sins. Romans 8:34 Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us

____(a) Again this verse brings these three phases of Christ’s ministry together.

____( Another word for the atonement of sins is the intercessory work for us.

____© He is our only Mediator that presents His blood to the Father in our behalf. 1 Timothy 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus

e. This work of Christ as our Mediator gives Him a special title to which we need to give special consideration. Hebrews 3:1 Wherefore, holy brethren, partakers of the heavenly calling, consider the Apostle and High Priest of our profession, Christ Jesus

__(1) He is our chief Apostle or Minister and our High Priest.

__(2) Where is our High Priest at today? Hebrews 8:1 Now of the things which we have spoken this is the sum: We have such an high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens

____(a) If we were to read the book of Hebrews from chapter 1-7, chapter 8 sums up all that Paul is talking about.

____( In other words, this is his main point, this is what he was trying to get at in those chapters.

__(3) Where is He ministering? Where is He interceeding? Hebrews 8:2 A minister of the sanctuary, and of the true tabernacle, which the Lord pitched, and not man

____(a) If He were on earth He would not have needed to work in the temple here because they had priests working there. Hebrews 8:3-4 For every high priest is ordained to offer gifts and sacrifices: wherefore it is of necessity that this man have somewhat also to offer. 4 For if he were on earth, he should not be a priest, seeing that there are priests that offer gifts according to the law

____( But the whole purpose of the sanctuary service, the ministration in the temple was to show what the work of Christ is like. Hebrews 8:5 Who serve unto the example and shadow of heavenly things, as Moses was admonished of God when he was about to make the tabernacle: for, See, saith he, that thou make all things according to the pattern shewed to thee in the mount

______[1] From this context, it clearly shows that Moses made the original sanctuary according to a pattern of the real in heaven.

__(4) This ministry in the heavenly sanctuary or heavenly temple is more excellent than the one on earth. Hebrews 8:6 But now hath he obtained a more excellent ministry, by how much also he is the mediator of a better covenant, which was established upon better promises

____(a) The reason being is that the blood of animals can never change a person. Hebrews 10:1-4 For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect 2 For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins. 3 But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year 4 For it is not possible that the blood of bulls and of goats should take away sins

f. This is the work of Christ working in our behalf right now. Hebrews 9:22-24 And almost all things are by the law purged with blood; and without shedding of blood is no remission. 23 It was therefore necessary that the patterns of things in the heavens should be purified with these; but the heavenly things themselves with better sacrifices than these. 24 For Christ is not entered into the holy places made with hands, which are the figures of the true; but into heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of God for us

____(1) So when we are praying to the Father in the name of Jesus, we are actually looking unto Jesus. Hebrews 12:2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God

____(2) By the study of this topic, we can know where Christ is, where to look unto, and follow His work there in our behalf.

[miz3]

John317 and others,

Sonny is right. If humans are judged by their works they are dead! It is impossible for us to be saved by our works. Our works have nothing to do with being saved. Works have a different purpose. John you are misinterpreting the Scripture and such often happens because of our connections to Ellen White and her uninspired views.

First, we are saved only by the merits of Jesus Christ and his perfection in keeping the law of God. Second, we are saved because Jesus Christ paid our penalty in full.

Does this mean that "works" are irrelevant? NO!!!!!!!!!!!

If you read the Scripture "works" that are lawful are done because of the SANCTIFYING WORK OF THE HOLY SPIRIT (thus the term Sanctification).

Many humans mix the finished work of Salvation in the two items above. Those two items are what JUSTIFY US (thus the term Justification).

It is an easy, but fundamental mistake, for humans both SDA and others to mix the two processes.

One (JUSTIFICATION) is a FINISHED WORK! The other (SANCTIFICATION) is still an ongoing work of the Holy Spirit until Jesus Comes Again!

SDA mistakenly get confused about this. Other Churches do too because they do not understand what "grace" and "works" mean in the Bible. This is why you have the Grace group and the Legalistic group.

Within SDA we see the Battle of Ellen White quotes in order to bolster which ever group position we are trying to support.

I continually stand amazed at how few really know the Scripture in regard to this vital Doctrine of Salvation. Part of the problem is SDA are so wound up in Ellen White and their "special or unique" Doctrines that the greatness and beauty of what God has done for us in His Plan of Salvation gets lost and/or confused.

No! this is not a personal attack intended to ruffle feathers and to stir up everyone's anger against me. I say this because we (including me!!!!) have much to learn at the Feet of Jesus Christ!

[karl]

Sonny is right. If humans are judged by their works they are dead!

The investigative judgment is FOR us, not against us. Think of it in terms of Ezekiel 36:26 and 27. Think of it in terms of Zechariah 3.

[John317]

John317 and others,

Sonny is right. If humans are judged by their works they are dead! It is impossible for us to be saved by our works. Our works have nothing to do with being saved. Works have a different purpose. John you are misinterpreting the Scripture and such often happens because of our connections to Ellen White and her uninspired views.

First, we are saved only by the merits of Jesus Christ and his perfection in keeping the law of God. Second, we are saved because Jesus Christ paid our penalty in full.

The IJ doesn't mean people are saved by works of the law. Of course we are saved by God's mercy through faith in Christ, and it's only by the merits of Christ that anyone is saved. True faith in Christ leads to works of faith just as a good tree produces good fruit. If people are abiding in the Vine, they will produce good fruit.

The IJ shows who has true faith in Christ and who does not. It shows who is safe to save and who isn't.

Here are the official statements of SDA beliefs on this subject:

Quote:

10. Experience of Salvation:

In infinite love and mercy God made Christ, who knew no sin, to be sin for us, so that in Him we might be made the righteousness of God. Led by the Holy Spirit we sense our need, acknowledge our sinfulness, repent of our transgressions, and exercise faith in Jesus as Lord and Christ, as Substitute and Example. This faith which receives salvation comes through the divine power of the Word and is the gift of God's grace. Through Christ we are justified, adopted as God's sons and daughters, and delivered from the lordship of sin. Through the Spirit we are born again and sanctified; the Spirit renews our minds, writes God's law of love in our hearts, and we are given the power to live a holy life. Abiding in Him we become partakers of the divine nature and have the assurance of salvation now and in the judgment. (2 Cor. 5:17-21; John 3:16; Gal. 1:4; 4:4-7; Titus 3:3-7; John 16:8; Gal. 3:13, 14; 1 Peter 2:21, 22; Rom. 10:17; Luke 17:5; Mark 9:23, 24; Eph. 2:5-10; Rom. 3:21-26; Col. 1:13, 14; Rom. 8:14-17; Gal. 3:26; John 3:3-8; 1 Peter 1:23; Rom. 12:2; Heb. 8:7-12; Eze. 36:25-27; 2 Peter 1:3, 4; Rom. 8:1-4; 5:6-10.)

11. Growing in Christ:

By His death on the cross Jesus triumphed over the forces of evil. He who subjugated the demonic spirits during His earthly ministry has broken their power and made certain their ultimate doom. Jesus' victory gives us victory over the evil forces that still seek to control us, as we walk with Him in peace, joy, and assurance of His love. Now the Holy Spirit dwells within us and empowers us. Continually committed to Jesus as our Saviour and Lord, we are set free from the burden of our past deeds. No longer do we live in the darkness, fear of evil powers, ignorance, and meaninglessness of our former way of life. In this new freedom in Jesus, we are called to grow into the likeness of His character, communing with Him daily in prayer, feeding on His Word, meditating on it and on His providence, singing His praises, gathering together for worship, and participating in the mission of the Church. As we give ourselves in loving service to those around us and in witnessing to His salvation, His constant presence with us through the Spirit transforms every moment and every task into a spiritual experience. (Ps 1:1, 2; 23:4; 77:11, 12; Col 1:13, 14; 2:6, 14, 15; Luke 10:17-20; Eph 5:19, 20; 6:12-18; 1 Thess 5:23; 2 Peter 2:9; 3:18; 2 Cor. 3:17, 18; Phil 3:7-14; 1 Thess 5:16-18; Matt 20:25-28; John 20:21; Gal 5:22-25; Rom 8:38, 39; 1 John 4:4; Heb 10:25.)

24. Christ's Ministry in the Heavenly Sanctuary:

There is a sanctuary in heaven, the true tabernacle which the Lord set up and not man. In it Christ ministers on our behalf, making available to believers the benefits of His atoning sacrifice offered once for all on the cross. He was inaugurated as our great High Priest and began His intercessory ministry at the time of His ascension. In 1844, at the end of the prophetic period of 2300 days, He entered the second and last phase of His atoning ministry. It is a work of investigative judgment which is part of the ultimate disposition of all sin, typified by the cleansing of the ancient Hebrew sanctuary on the Day of Atonement. In that typical service the sanctuary was cleansed with the blood of animal sacrifices, but the heavenly things are purified with the perfect sacrifice of the blood of Jesus. The investigative judgment reveals to heavenly intelligences who among the dead are asleep in Christ and therefore, in Him, are deemed worthy to have part in the first resurrection. It also makes manifest who among the living are abiding in Christ, keeping the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus, and in Him, therefore, are ready for translation into His everlasting kingdom. This judgment vindicates the justice of God in saving those who believe in Jesus. It declares that those who have remained loyal to God shall receive the kingdom. The completion of this ministry of Christ will mark the close of human probation before the Second Advent. (Heb. 8:1-5; 4:14-16; 9:11-28; 10:19-22; 1:3; 2:16, 17; Dan. 7:9-27; 8:13, 14; 9:24-27; Num. 14:34; Eze. 4:6; Lev. 16; Rev. 14:6, 7; 20:12; 14:12; 22:12.)

[John317]

John you are misinterpreting the Scripture and such often happens because of our connections to Ellen White and her uninspired views.

Here's another example of making a claim without giving any evidence or showing your reasoning for saying what you do.

If you think I'm saying that our works save us, you are wrong. That is not what I am saying. But our works do show whether we have true faith and belief in Christ.

When Jeuss said, "If you love me, you will obey my commandments," He meant exactly what He said. And that is the relationship between works and salvation. Works don't save us--- but rather works of faith show whether we have been justified and are being saved.

Matthew 7:21-23

"Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. [22] On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?' [23] And then will I declare to them, 'I never knew you; depart from me, you workers of lawlessness.'

Will workers of lawlessness be saved? Obviously not. Why not? Because their life proves that they don't have true faith in and love for Christ.

1 Cor. 6:9-11

Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality, [10] nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God. [11] And such were some of you. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the Spirit of our God.

NOTE: Justified and washed people do not continue to practice the sins that verses 9 and 10 speak of. If people continue to practice those sins, it proves they don't love Jesus and aren't his true follower.

[John317]

....such often happens because of our connections to Ellen White and her uninspired views.

You apparently believe that Ellen White was not a true prophet of God. Earlier you appeared to say that you were defending her and that you felt that she is often treated "shabbily." Now it becomes evident that you don't believe in her prophetic ministry or in her writings.

Do you believe any of her views or writings were inspired by God-- or do you believe none of them were inspired?

[John317]

...Salvation is not achieved by keeping the Ten Commandments period, it also requires that we practice the truth. Jesus told Pilate that the reason for His coming to this earth was to testify to the truth, that we would know the truth if we believed and practiced His testimony. The testimony of Jesus is the gospel of the kingdom.

We're not saved by keeping the Ten Commandments or by practicing the truth, because we can't do any of those things unless we are first in right relationship with God and are being saved. God sends the Holy Spirit into the lives of those who truly put their faith/trust/confidence in Christ. It's the Spirit who produces the fruit. Our work is to continually submit ourselves wholly to God and allow His Spirit to abide with us and teach us. Those things are the fruit of genuine faith; they are not the ground of our salvation.

It's like a marriage relationship. There's no one who thinks that by giving his wife or husband a gift, they will become married to that person. Rather, the gift is the result of being married. So it is with our relationship with God. Our works of faith are the result of our relationship, and not the other way around.

The Bible is very clear that the testimony of Jesus is the Spirit of prophecy. Jesus' witness is the Holy Spirit's manifestation in prophetic utterance. The gift of prophecy was restored to the church at the time when God was raising up a people who would keep His commandments. It is Jesus' witness (or proof) that He is leading the Remnant church at the time of the end.

[rudywoofs (Pam)]

SDA fail Ellen White in the following ways:

a. They believe everything we have of her writings is "inspired". That is why we have so many books, pamphlets, and other writings available to the people (especially the SDA Church members).

b. SDA believe that Ellen White was most often in the "on" position and most believe she was never in the "off" position. Church leaders have fostered this idea not only while she was alive but even more strenuously after her death.

c. SDA never cite her writings as just her own opinion but that everything we have in print is "inspired" and direct from the mouth of God. Thus, we never, ever see writings that are stated openly as just Ellen White's personal views. She had personal views and they show up quite frequently in her writings but the SDA Church takes these personal views and declares then "inspired".

d. Ellen White spoke over an extremely wide range of issues but we never, ever hear from the SDA that any of these things were nothing more than her personal views. Even when Ellen White is inconsistent in her statements she is "inspired". This website has demonstrated a few such inconsistencies.

e. Most egregious is the use of Ellen White as the last word to settle any dispute. Then SDA have the arrogance to declare that they are a Bible and Bible only Church. How sad it is to see such blatant and open duplicity. The big shame is they think they can get away with it by simply denying it.

hmm. a,b,c, & d are all saying the same thing. I don't know of any Adventist who thinks that everything EGW wrote was inspired.

As for e, well, actually, your entire postings on the forum: why are you so angry at Adventists?

Are you an SDA? I know another forum where your views would be most welcome and would embrace you as having the gift of discernment. But it isn't an Adventist forum..

[Sonny]

Sonny, obey the law, by faith, no excuses.

Sure, as soon as you live Christ's life. But you are too busy with self-love to do that....No one is living Christ's life...no one. Want to test my statement? I'll be happy to give you a quiz.

[miz3]

I don't know of any Adventist who thinks that everything EGW wrote was inspired.

OK, since you don't believe Ellen White and ALL her writings were inspired give me a list of her writings that are NOT INSPIRED.

[Gerr]

Originally Posted By: ClubV12

Sonny, obey the law, by faith, no excuses.

Sure, as soon as you live Christ's life. But you are too busy with self-love to do that....No one is living Christ's life...no one. Want to test my statement? I'll be happy to give you a quiz.

So NOBODY is living Christ's life perfectly, THAT'S why we NEED Him to save us. What's your point?

[ClubV12]

As I recall the advice she gave on the "reform dress" she noted was her own opinion. Which reminds me of Paul when he also mentions his ideas on marriage are his own opinion.

In either case, the counsel should be carefully weighed because of the record of those speaking. Much the same as when a Godly member of the church offers you counsel, it should be seriously considered for it's value, rather than immediately tossed out as "mere opinion".

If you feel it is impossible to keep the law, by faith, you set yourself up for failure. I believe it IS possible, by faith. Whether I fail or not is beside the point, the law illustrates the best way of life for mankind, a worthy goal and primer on how to live your life. Man MUST have laws to live by, without God's laws we would simply make up our own. Civil laws are actually a reflection of the 10 commandments. As were the laws of Moses. If not for God's laws upon what would we base the laws of our lives? Since keeping the law is impossible, do we then ignore them?

The civil, moral and ethical law says "don't steal". It is for your protection as well as the protection of society. It's not just a good idea, it's the LAW. By faith, I will accept the services of a defense attorney who sit's by the throne of God. He will make a compelling argument for my case to be dismissed. Unless I reject His counsel, defiantely, openly, consistently by choosing my own path.

[miz3]

As I recall the advice she gave on the "reform dress" she noted was her own opinion. Which reminds me of Paul when he also mentions his ideas on marriage are his own opinion

.

Thank you for that example.

Is this the ONLY time she spoke or wrote her own opinion?

If so then that means you accept every other thing she said or wrote as being "divinely inspired".

Is this your position?

[John317]

The books and writings Ellen White wrote for the church are all inspired by God.

She didn't write her own opinion in place of the instruction God wanted her to give for the church.

See 1 SM 25-45.

[John317]

Do you accept any of Ellen G. White's writings as inspired? Or in your opinion, are all of them equally false?

[miz3]

John317,

Then you don't agree with the position of "rudywoofs" and "ClubV12".

You believe that absolutely every word Ellen White wrote or spoke was "inspired" and that nothing she wrote or said was her own "opinion".

Do I have that correct?

[Kevin H]

The role of the prophet is an office. Such as the office of the President of the United States. We don't ask what was presidential and what is not presidential, but we talk about the person who is holding the office. So with Prophets, it is things that a prophet was doing whether the prophet is discussing a vision or giving a shopping list it is things done by someone holding the office. Words are not inspired, people are. The issue is will we accept Prophets, such as Mrs. White on their own terms, or are we going to accept them on our terms which are too often Fundamentalism.

Mrs. White's visions gave her principles and a framework, the 3 aspects of the trinity, the 3 deceptions of Satan and how they are played out over history and how God answers the 3 deceptions. Part of this the role of health in our life. At a time when women were wearing long dresses that was sweeping the streets, and dirt road streets that people have emptied their chamber pots and horses have been traveling over, and picking up germs. Mrs. White was trying to help people develope a dress that would pick up less germs in that situation. However people thinking in a fundamentalist mindset was looking for strict instructions in every word as a perfect message from God and was missing the principles she was presenting and was missing the forrest for the trees and was very overly conserned about the slighest details and being a pain in the neck to Mrs. White wanting her to give more and more details so she finally said "Forget it" and tried to teach what visions do and don't do for her. But we don't want to hear that message. We are Augustinians who believe that Bible writer's are God's pen, not his penmen, Mrs. White agreed with Jerome who said that the Bible writers are God's Pen men, not his pen. Typical Adventists believe in theory, and because she said so, that she is not infailible (however they tend to believe that she just never made a mistake) and when concreat factual points are pointed out where she was indeed not infailible, the typical Adventist either starts to tapdance over it and explain how she really did not make the mistake, or when they can no longer do this they turn against her and say she was not inspired. The problem is a false view of inspiration that they refuse to give up.

The investigative judgment plays a major role to the issues of the Great Controversy. Items such as the reform dress, the cause of earthquakes and volcanios, and topics of exogesis which is our job to study out, such as what is the meaning of the daily, may be useful but are not central studying to the 3 deceptions of Satan and how God is dealing with them.

[BobRyan]

Where in the Bible is the term "Investigative Judgment?

I have never seen this term used in the Bible?

Is this a concept? If so where is the Biblical backing for this concept?

Daniel 7 - the judgment in heaven is based on books "the court sat and the books were opened" Dan 7:10.

[John317]

You believe that absolutely every word Ellen White wrote or spoke was "inspired" and that nothing she wrote or said was her own "opinion".

Do I have that correct?

No, of course not. She talked and wrote about common things that had no realtionship to her work as a prophet.

If you read 1 SM 27-45, all of your questions on this point will be answered.

[Gerr]

Originally Posted By: miz3

Where in the Bible is the term "Investigative Judgment?

I have never seen this term used in the Bible?

Is this a concept? If so where is the Biblical backing for this concept?

Daniel 7 - the judgment in heaven is based on books "the court sat and the books were opened" Dan 7:10.

Here again are the passages miz3 has danced around:

ESV | 2 Co 5:10 For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, so that each one may receive what is due for what he has done in the body, whether good or evil.

ESV | 1 Pe 4:17 For it is time for judgment to begin at the household of God; and if it begins with us, what will be the outcome for...

NASB Dt 13:14 then you shall investigate and search out and inquire thoroughly. If it is true and the matter establishe d that this abomination has been done among you,

NIV84 | Dt 17:4 and °this has been brought to your attention, then you °must investigate it thoroughly. If it is true and °it has been proved that °this detestable thing has been done in Israel,

NASB Dt 19:18 The judges shall investigate thoroughly , and if the witness is a false witness and he has accused his brother falsely,

[miz3]

Gerry,

Your amazing!

2Corinthians 5:10 which you cited, has nothing to do with an Investigative Judgment. It's not even implied, inferred, alluded to, etc. anywhere in that text.

1Peter 4:17 which you also cited is making a comparison between the righteous and the wicked. Peter is saying only, that if God judges the Righteous, then the wicked will also be judged.

Peter is not talking about some special investigative judgment. Again their is no context for such a conclusion. It also is not inferred, implied, alluded to, etc. anywhere in the text.

What method of interpretation do you use, again?

Personally I take the text and its context for what it is actually saying, not for what I want it to say.

Oh, yea, we must not forget your Deuteronomy texts. In the three you cited there is nothing direct, or indirect, inferred, implied, alluded to, etc. that these texts are talking about the "investigative judgment" or even the "principle" of an investigative judgment.

In all three of these texts, Gerry, God is telling the human judges what procedures they are to follow. These texts are about HUMAN TO HUMAN relationships.

Your view of the investigative judgment is about a God to righteous human relationship and such a relationship has nothing, absolutely nothing to do with your Deuteronomy texts.

You are not careful about your Bible study, Gerry. I may be wrong, but it appears to me that you are just throwing almost any Biblical text at the issue and hoping that one or more may hit the target. I hate to tell you, Gerry, but none of the texts you've cited anywhere comes close to hitting the "investigative judgment" target, let alone be even close to the center.

[Woody]

Miz3 - Gerry tends to do that. But he has a good heart. And we do love having him here. We just have to take his theology with a grain of salt.

[Gail]

Miz3 - Gerry tends to do that. But he has a good heart. And we do love having him here. We just have to take his theology with a grain of salt.

Hey, I like Gerry a LOT!! An oldie but goodie!