Lysimachus Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Your 70weeks theory falls apart because there is no year/day principle! End of theory! What is your position on the 70 weeks anyway? Do you even believe it is a time prophecy? Do you believe the 70 weeks are literally 70 weeks (490 days as opposed to 490 years)? If so, please explain when this time period started, and when it ended. And if so, also explain why the Messiah came centuries after this "literal" time frame. Now assuming you do believe the 70 weeks represent 490 years, please explain, in-detail, why you believe the day-for-year principle cannot and is not applied, and also explain how 70 x 7 translates into 490 years. I like to know people's exact positions, and their reasons why before I attempt to challenge their views. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Why is the seventy weeks important for "YOU" to understand? Quote
ClubV12 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Ha Ha, why should we even read the book of Daniel? I mean, what kind of question IS that? Why is the book of Revelation important? Or, Acts for that matter! Quote
Lysimachus Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Why is the seventy weeks important for "YOU" to understand? No disrespect, but that is a very dumb question. Concerning Daniel, Jesus said "whoso readeth, let him understand?" Would you have questioned Jesus and said "why is this important for us to understand?" Doesn't the name of Jesus, the "wonderful numberer" mean anything to you? Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Lysimachus Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Why is the seventy weeks important for "YOU" to understand? Did you know that if you purposely try to avoid understanding these things, you can't be saved? The Bible teaches that. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 No disrespect, but that is a very dumb question. Concerning Daniel, Jesus said "whoso readeth, let him understand?" Would you have questioned Jesus and said "why is this important for us to understand?" Doesn't the name of Jesus, the "wonderful numberer" mean anything to you? No disrespect, but the question is very important! The fact that you think it is a "dumb" question tells us why should we take you seriously in regards to your "theo"? In fact you not being able to answer the question tells us that your theo is really not very important at all! Dumb question? Hmmmm! So just answer the question! Quote
Lysimachus Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Originally Posted By: Lysimachus No disrespect, but that is a very dumb question. Concerning Daniel, Jesus said "whoso readeth, let him understand?" Would you have questioned Jesus and said "why is this important for us to understand?" Doesn't the name of Jesus, the "wonderful numberer" mean anything to you? No disrespect, but the question is very important! The fact that you think it is a "dumb" question tells us why should we take you seriously in regards to your "theo"? In fact you not being able to answer the question tells us that your theo is really not very important at all! Dumb question? Hmmmm! So just answer the question! What is interesting here is that you attempt to ask me a question when I asked you a question first. I asked you to explain to me your views on the 70 weeks, and gave specific questions which I expected to be answered. But then you turned around and asked me a question instead of answering mine. So here's the deal. You answer my questions first, then I'll go on to proceed to answering yours, now that I understand your question more. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Answering my question is part of answering your questions. I fully intend to give more of an answer but please answer my question first then we can proceed! Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 I'm really no longer in the mood for continuing this discussion with you. I feel that you are acting too unreasonable, and I'd rather invest that time for hungry sheep, and those who can dialogue maturely. So long, and farewell. I ask a simple question which requires a simple answer and you run off as if you are a wounded bear! Talk about being MATURE! Hmmmm! Talk about being UNREASONABLE! Hmmmm! Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 I'd rather invest that time for hungry sheep Sounds to me like you are looking for "mind numbed robots" who don't ask questions. Such "mind numbed robots" will just sit at your "elitist" feet and "bill and coo" how great you are! That just shows how SHALLOW your theo really is! Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Yes, you are frequently rude! But I forgive you because you are not aware of your of your own ignorance! Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 I wonder who took us off topic now Lysimachus! Could that be you? Yes! it was you! Quote
cheddar Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Originally Posted By: miz3 Your 70weeks theory falls apart because there is no year/day principle! End of theory! What is your position on the 70 weeks anyway? Do you even believe it is a time prophecy? Do you believe the 70 weeks are literally 70 weeks (490 days as opposed to 490 years)? If so, please explain when this time period started, and when it ended. And if so, also explain why the Messiah came centuries after this "literal" time frame. Now assuming you do believe the 70 weeks represent 490 years, please explain, in-detail, why you believe the day-for-year principle cannot and is not applied, and also explain how 70 x 7 translates into 490 years. I like to know people's exact positions, and their reasons why before I attempt to challenge their views. The 70 week prophecy refers to the last seventy weeks of human probation, the time when Jesus passes from the holy place into the holiest of all. Christians have always seen the verse ‘to anoint the most Holy’ as applying to Jesus Christ but if we look at the original hebrew word it’s the same one used all throughout the OT in reference to the most holy place not the most holy one. The 70 weeks occur just after the 7 trumpets of Revelation and just prior to the 7 last plagues (time of trouble) and this is exactly what we find in the OT sanctuary service. Feast of Trumpets -> Day of Atonement -> Feast of Tabernacles Ellen White spoke so much about the close of human probation with no credible biblical evidence to prove it. The 70 weeks is the best evidence to support the close of probation and antitypical day of atonement but only if it’s seen in the last days. Remember, not only was the understanding of Daniel’s visions for the ‘time of the end’ but the application is for the time of the end as well. Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Remember, not only was the understanding of Daniel’s visions for the ‘time of the end’ but the application is for the time of the end as well. Which "time of the end"? Quote
ClubV12 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Wow, it's amazing how many people are so easily confused on the 2,300 year prophecy. It's not really that complicated. It's a continuous line of time, not a part to be taken out here and there. It began in 457 and ended in 1844. The 70 weeks occured in between, it's done, finished. It has nothing to do with future events. Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Wow, it's amazing how many people are so easily confused on the 2,300 year prophecy. It's not really that complicated. It's a continuous line of time, not a part to be taken out here and there. It began in 457 and ended in 1844. The 70 weeks occured in between, it's done, finished. It has nothing to do with future events. NO "YEAR/DAY"! NO CLUBV12 TIMELINE! Quote
Lysimachus Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 The 70 week prophecy refers to the last seventy weeks of human probation, the time when Jesus passes from the holy place into the holiest of all. Christians have always seen the verse ‘to anoint the most Holy’ as applying to Jesus Christ but if we look at the original hebrew word it’s the same one used all throughout the OT in reference to the most holy place not the most holy one. The 70 weeks occur just after the 7 trumpets of Revelation and just prior to the 7 last plagues (time of trouble) and this is exactly what we find in the OT sanctuary service. Feast of Trumpets -> Day of Atonement -> Feast of Tabernacles Ellen White spoke so much about the close of human probation with no credible biblical evidence to prove it. The 70 weeks is the best evidence to support the close of probation and antitypical day of atonement but only if it’s seen in the last days. Remember, not only was the understanding of Daniel’s visions for the ‘time of the end’ but the application is for the time of the end as well. More winds of doctrine, flying to and fro. It's amazing how many ridiculous views that keep emanating from the unconverted. People just love to enjoy their wild flings with new ideas. They get a kick out of it, and it gives them a high. Cheddar, Adventists have not doubted that the anointing of the Most Holy has to do with the Most Holy Place in heaven. In 31 A.D., when Christ ascended to heaven, He anointed the Most Holy Place. Note that this is not the same as performing Day of Atonement ministration. Plenty of Old Testament scriptures reveal that Moses entered into the Holy of Holies and dedicated and anointed the sanctuary. With this single stroke, your entire theology falls to pieces. Basically, you are completely eliminating that the 70 weeks pointed to Christ's first coming. This is more futuristic nonsense that does not account for the past, because you wish to cuddle up to your own private interpretations rather than ACCEPTING the counsel of the brethren! And once again, I see that you are yet another Ellen White basher who has no respect for the modern gift of prophecy. Your own private interpretations are more important to you than to let the spirit of prophecy speak. Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
Lysimachus Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 YES YEAR/DAY PRINCIPLE! Now zip your trap. *Ok, I just lost it. Forgive me* Quote ~Lysimachus (Marcos S.) Author of article, Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation (see attachment for article) Currently writing a book, Vindicating the Historical School of Prophetic Interpretation Founder of the largest and fastest SDA Apologetics Group on Facebook, Seventh-Day Adventism - Defending the Pillars of the Faith Writer and apologetics contributor at Adventist Defense League Vindicating the Year-Day Principle of Prophetic Interpretation.pdf
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 you wish to cuddle up to your own private interpretations rather than ACCEPTING the counsel of the brethren! I wasn't aware the "counsel of the brethren" was Scripture. I thought the Bible was Scripture! Oh, ya my mistake, the "counsel of the brethren" actually in your world "supersedes" the counsel of the Bible! Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Quote: Originally Posted By: cheddarRemember, not only was the understanding of Daniel’s visions for the ‘time of the end’ but the application is for the time of the end as well. Which "time of the end"? My question remains, cheddar, WHICH "TIME OF THE END"? Quote
Guest Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Originally Posted By: Lysimachus you wish to cuddle up to your own private interpretations rather than ACCEPTING the counsel of the brethren! I wasn't aware the "counsel of the brethren" was Scripture. I thought the Bible was Scripture! Oh, ya my mistake, the "counsel of the brethren" actually in your world "supersedes" the counsel of the Bible! You ought to stop. Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 Well you berated a person in such a way as to imply at the very least that the Brethren were the last word and that they alone knew the way of salvation. This was your statement and your implied threat! I was merely responding to your actual words. Is that the message you were sending to cheddar? Quote
miz3 Posted July 18, 2011 Posted July 18, 2011 If you want to talk about what the Bible says then let's talk about what the Bible says. The "Brethren" have nothing to do with it. Threatening persons with the Brethren and making wild statements about people losing their salvation is NOT TALKING ABOUT WHAT THE BIBLE SAYS. You are the ones talking about everything but what the Bible says. You threaten people (especially me) with burning in hell because they (I)do not see things the way you do! That is a real advertisement to all the nonSDA listening and reading on this forum! Is this the advertisement you want. You cannot advance on the merits so you resort to threats on others in regard to the "brethren" and in regard to there burning in "hell"! That does not bode well for those you are trying to convince of your theories. Let your "gospel" stand on the Word of God and its clear Words. Don't stand on your threats and you inferences, your additions to Scripture, etc. Such as reading in a year/day principle when it is clear that none exists. And you say to me "Stop it". That's rich! Quote
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