Moderators John317 Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 Well, this forum has certainly taught me that the SDA is like the church world, greatly divided against itself and full of different ideas. You make the same mistake many who come here make, which is to assume that this Forum is anything like the SDA church. It isn't. The Forum consists of many non-SDAs, former SDAs, anti-SDAs, antiChristians, anti-EGWs, athetists, agnostics, etc. Speaking of which, what church do you attend? You could attend SDAs church all your life in differtent parts of the world and never see or hear the things you see on the Forum. John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
ClubV12 Posted December 18, 2011 Posted December 18, 2011 Many people don't see it. I see it, it clear and convincing. At the very least there are major and minor prophets. Moses was certainly major. The bible speaks of a "man of God" who prophesied, I would say he was minor. ALL the people of Corinth were certainly minor. The people in your church are minor. Major prophets do in fact make future predictions, Daniel is notable in that regard. Anybody in your church spoke of future events to date? There are prophets, and then they are simply "men of God", a BIG difference in my opinion. Don't reject the genuine prophets as the people of Christs day did.
Moderators John317 Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 God raised up a prophet in our day-- that is, in 1844-1915-- the same as He did in Bible times. He did not make all Israel or all the church a prophet. He did not give all of them dreams and visions. Originally Posted By: BibleOnly Interesting. Act 2:17 And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams: Act 2:18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: Doesn't sound that exclusive to me... Neither do those verses teach that all the members of the church are prophets. Even during Peter's time, not all were prophets. Paul asked whether all are prophets, and the obvious answer was no. Not all receive the same spiritual gift. Not all are teachers and not all are pastors or evangelists. The Holy Spirit distributes the gifts as He wills. John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Originally Posted By: Bibleonly The bible defines tongues in the church as being what I say they are. Bible the only authority and then you say that "the Bible defines tongues in the church as being what I say they are?" Did you really mean to say that you define what the Bible says about tongues? Quote: I'm sorry, I don't know what to say to that. Yes, I meant to say that the Bible defines tongues to be in line with what I claim they are. The bible defines what tongues are. I happen to be saying what the Bible says, I am right only because the Bible provides the definition and I agree with it. Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo I'm sorry. I should have quoted, I know that you guys read the Bible, but that the sort of things that I talk about go right over your heads when you read them ( seriously, you read the Bible and synthesise it with your views, finding the Sabbath everywhere, and glossing over things that you assume just don't happen anymore ). 1Cr 14:31 For ye may all prophesy one by one, that all may learn, and all may be comforted. There is one. Prophecy in the NT is a gift all Christians have, and it's not telling the future, but expounding the Bible. Thus, the test is, does the Bible say it Is it possible you overlooked ch 12 & the preceding verses in ch 14? Did Paul say everyone believer IS a prophet? Here is what he says:
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Neither do those verses teach that all the members of the church are prophets. Even during Peter's time, not all were prophets. Paul asked whether all are prophets, and the obvious answer was no. Not all receive the same spiritual gift. Not all are teachers and not all are pastors or evangelists. The Holy Spirit distributes the gifts as He wills. Yet 1 Cor 14 says explicitly that they could all speak in tongues, that every tongues speaker could interpret, and that we can all prophecy. Not all are teachers or pastors, but that's a different thing, and no-one is instantly chosen to be a pastor, they are raised up according to the churches need. A pastor is a gift to the church, not a gift to the person given the role. And of course if we speak of prophecy as a gift, we're in the realm of 1 Cor 12, where we're either all prophets, or not all of us have faith, or wisdom, or discernment. Another issue no-one will address with me.
Moderators Gerr Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 It is interesting to note that most of the replies I'm getting today are on this thread. Nothing riles up the SDA more than questioning the special status and holiness of Ellen White, it seems. Doesn't bother me one bit that a non-Adventist doubts/questions her prophetic gift. But if you are ever curious enough to check her writings out for yourself and not just by hearsay, check out her books, "Steps to Christ", "Desire of Ages", "Great Controversy", "Education", "Ministry of Healing", "Patriarchs and Prophets," among the many she has written.
Administrators Naomi Posted December 18, 2011 Administrators Posted December 18, 2011 Originally Posted By: BibleOnly Well, this forum has certainly taught me that the SDA is like the church world, greatly divided against itself and full of different ideas. You make the same mistake many who come here make, which is to assume that this Forum is anything like the SDA church. It isn't. The Forum consists of many non-SDAs, former SDAs, anti-SDAs, antiChristians, anti-EGWs, athetists, agnostics, etc. You could attend SDAs church all your life in differtent parts of the world and never see or hear the things you see on the Forum. Amen!!!!!!!! If your dreams are not big enough to scare you, they are not big enough for God
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Many people don't see it. I see it, it clear and convincing. At the very least there are major and minor prophets. Moses was certainly major. The bible speaks of a "man of God" who prophesied, I would say he was minor. ALL the people of Corinth were certainly minor. The people in your church are minor. Major prophets do in fact make future predictions, Daniel is notable in that regard. Anybody in your church spoke of future events to date? There are prophets, and then they are simply "men of God", a BIG difference in my opinion. Don't reject the genuine prophets as the people of Christs day did. The difference is simply that Paul talks about prophets and prophecy as being the same thing, in the church age, where the vision has been sealed, the message delivered and there's no need for any further instruction about future events. Prophecy could never be about human events, but about what God is doing. What God is going to do, is clear in the Bible, Revelation giving us all the picture we need of the details of the coming of the next age. That book is sealed and cursed is the person who adds to it. Anyone claiming to have fresh revelation of future events tries to add to the vision of Revelation, even if they don't try to make it chapter 23.
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Neither do those verses teach that all the members of the church are prophets. Even during Peter's time, not all were prophets. Paul asked whether all are prophets, and the obvious answer was no. Not all receive the same spiritual gift. Not all are teachers and not all are pastors or evangelists. The Holy Spirit distributes the gifts as He wills. Paul SAID all were prophets. He asked do all prophecy in a given meeting, and the answer is indeed no, explicitly in the Greek. Given what the 1 Cor 12 list is, does this mean not all Christians have faith, or wisdom, or ability to ask God for healing ?
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Originally Posted By: BibleOnly It is interesting to note that most of the replies I'm getting today are on this thread. Nothing riles up the SDA more than questioning the special status and holiness of Ellen White, it seems. Doesn't bother me one bit that a non-Adventist doubts/questions her prophetic gift. But if you are ever curious enough to check her writings out for yourself and not just by hearsay, check out her books, "Steps to Christ", "Desire of Ages", "Great Controversy", "Education", "Ministry of Healing", "Patriarchs and Prophets," among the many she has written. My point would be, why would I read the writings of someone who did not have the Holy Spirit, when I could read the Bible ? If I did read them, and I certainly do read books about the Bible, why would I quote them instead of the Bible verses they have, in my view, correctly explained ?
Moderators John317 Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 Neither do those verses teach that all the members of the church are prophets. Even during Peter's time, not all were prophets. Paul asked whether all are prophets, and the obvious answer was no. Not all receive the same spiritual gift. Not all are teachers and not all are pastors or evangelists. The Holy Spirit distributes the gifts as He wills. Originally Posted By: BibleOnly Yet 1 Cor 14 says explicitly that they could all speak in tongues, that every tongues speaker could interpret, and that we can all prophecy. You're not reading it correctly. For one thing, Paul clearly distinguishes between tongues and prophecy, and Paul instructs all to desire earnestly to prophesy. He doesn't say that every person can be a prophet. John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 OK, let's assume 'you can all prophecy' does not mean what it says. Let's assume that when Paul told them to not all speak in tongues at once, he didn't mean they all could. Let's assume when he said if someone speaks in tongues in a church, they should pray to interpret, this does not mean every tongues speaker could interpret. Let's assume that when Paul tells all in Corinth to desire to prophecy, he knew that God would deny many in Corinth this ability and that Paul's lifting of prophecy above tongues when used in the church, means that God gives better gifts to some Christians than others and is therefore showing partiality. If all of this is true, if Paul set out to remind the church in 1 Cor 12 that not everyone has the same gift, why does his list mean that not all Christians have faith, or wisdom, or discernment, or the ability to pray for miracles and healing ?
Moderators Gerr Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 It seems I keep saying the same things over and over. Let's see, can 1 Cor 12 make 1 Cor 14 a lie ? Is that how the Bible works ? Or is it all true ? The question to you is - does Paul in 14:31-32 contradict what he said in ch 12 & 14:1-2? He clearly asks, "Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret?" What's the point of bringing up these questions if everyone is an apostle or prophet or teacher or teacher? That's why Paul uses the body analogy. The body cannot be all eyes or all legs or all ears! Paul is not contradicting himself. What it looks like to me is that you need to look at 14:31-32 in the context of the preceding verses about spiritual gifts which goes back to the beginning of ch 12.
Moderators John317 Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 check out her books, "Steps to Christ", "Desire of Ages", "Great Controversy", "Education", "Ministry of Healing", "Patriarchs and Prophets," among the many she has written. Originally Posted By: BibleOnly My point would be, why would I read the writings of someone who did not have the Holy Spirit, when I could read the Bible ? If I did read them, and I certainly do read books about the Bible, why would I quote them instead of the Bible verses they have, in my view, correctly explained ? Read the books and find out on your own instead of depending on others to tell you what she wrote or whether she had the Holy Spirit. John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Originally Posted By: Bibleonly It seems I keep saying the same things over and over. Let's see, can 1 Cor 12 make 1 Cor 14 a lie ? Is that how the Bible works ? Or is it all true ? The question to you is - does Paul in 14:31-32 contradict what he said in ch 12 & 14:1-2? He clearly asks, "Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? Do all speak in tongues? Do all interpret?" What's the point of bringing up these questions if everyone is an apostle or prophet or teacher or teacher? That's why Paul uses the body analogy. The body cannot be all eyes or all legs or all ears! Paul is not contradicting himself. What it looks like to me is that you need to look at 14:31-32 in the context of the preceding verses about spiritual gifts which goes back to the beginning of ch 12. You're right. Paul is not contradicting himself. But you need to read what he says, not filter it through your experience. When does the church work as a body ? When they are all together. What is 1 Cor 12-14 ultimately about ? It's about them not speaking in tongues at once, but doing it one at a time, with interpretation and moving from the use of tongues ( the manifestation of the Spirit ) to interpretation and prophecy ( gifts every Christian can use, but which they need to seek to use, having not automatically done them at the time of conversion ). In that sense, talk of teaching and so on is really just to illustrate the core point. Again, you need to explain, why does Paul build up prophecy if only some can do it, and tell all to seek and value something that only some can have ? Why say 'you can all prophecy' if he means 'only those who have this gift can do it' ? It makes no sense to say it at all in this context.
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Originally Posted By: Gerry Cabalo check out her books, "Steps to Christ", "Desire of Ages", "Great Controversy", "Education", "Ministry of Healing", "Patriarchs and Prophets," among the many she has written. Originally Posted By: BibleOnly My point would be, why would I read the writings of someone who did not have the Holy Spirit, when I could read the Bible ? If I did read them, and I certainly do read books about the Bible, why would I quote them instead of the Bible verses they have, in my view, correctly explained ? Read the books and find out on your own instead of depending on others to tell you what she wrote or whether she had the Holy Spirit. The real question is, why can't I just read the Bible, why do I HAVE to read Ellen White ? If those who followed her deny the salvation experience that the Bible offers, then it seems fair to assume she didn't have the Spirit, but, of course, that is between her and God and not really my business, except to the degree I am expected to regard her as a 'super Christian' who I should look to as a guide to understanding and following God.
Moderators Gerr Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 OK, let's assume 'you can all prophecy' does not mean what it says. Let's assume that when Paul told them to not all speak in tongues at once, he didn't mean they all could. Let's assume when he said if someone speaks in tongues in a church, they should pray to interpret, this does not mean every tongues speaker could interpret. Let's assume that when Paul tells all in Corinth to desire to prophecy, he knew that God would deny many in Corinth this ability and that Paul's lifting of prophecy above tongues when used in the church, means that God gives better gifts to some Christians than others and is therefore showing partiality. If all of this is true, if Paul set out to remind the church in 1 Cor 12 that not everyone has the same gift, why does his list mean that not all Christians have faith, or wisdom, or discernment, or the ability to pray for miracles and healing ? You don't have to assume anything! There is no need to assume because he clearly shows in ch 12 that not all are eyes or ears in the body analogy, and neither are all apostles and prophets and teachers when the Holy Spirit apportions gifts. You can't just pick out one sentence or two or even a paragraph and forget what the author said before or afterwards! That is not rightly dividing the word of truth!That's why we have so many denominations!
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 You don't have to assume anything! There is no need to assume because he clearly shows in ch 12 that not all are eyes or ears in the body analogy, and neither are all apostles and prophets and teachers when the Holy Spirit apportions gifts. You can't just pick out one sentence or two or even a paragraph and forget what the author said before or afterwards! That is not rightly dividing the word of truth!That's why we have so many denominations! He clearly shows that when the body comes together, we don't all fill the same role. He does not show that we always fill the same role, every time the body comes together. The simple fact that he lists faith, discernment and wisdom in his list shows that he's not saying that only some have these things. That's the bit I'm hoping someone can explain to me.
Gibs Posted December 18, 2011 Posted December 18, 2011 The thing I see in this discussion is this, EGW didn't set herself up as king or head of the structure, church. Yes it was "Church" as long as it didn't set up a "visible" head of it. You see the Catholic church, structure has that, the Pope so it isn't Christ's Church at all but is the "Popes" structure, church. The True Church has only Him as it's head. And the name of that church cannot be a corporation church or it isn't His, Christ's. It is the corporations structure, church. But in no sense of the word can it be called church because Church is Ekklesia and is "the called out ones". His True Church can have no other name. It's members then which make up His Spiritual Body then are all in Him and He in they. They all have put on the Divine Nature offered by full and complete surrender and the will submerged in His will and are one in Him. Their will and love is one with His Will and Love. Then this means another thing then, in those members you have True Christian Unity, all are one in Him and all else falls short of that mark. Also these are those that receive His Mark, He marks each of them as His beloved Jewels. EGW's goal and purpose was to be a lesser light to lead to the Greater Light, Jesus Christ and His Wonderful True Word that leads one to Him, The Life that All may obtain eternal Life through Him. The Word to the Gentiles is "Christ in you the Hope of Glory." 1Jo 4:4 ¶ Ye are of God, little children, and have overcome them: because greater is he that is in you, than he that is in the world. A Freeman In Jesus Christ
Moderators John317 Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 OK, let's assume 'you can all prophecy' does not mean what it says. You need to read in context and quote the entire sentence in verse 31, 32: [31] For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged, [32] and the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets. 1 Cor. 14:1-33 Pursue love, and earnestly desire the spiritual gifts, especially that you may prophesy. [2] For one who speaks in a tongue speaks not to men but to God; for no one understands him, but he utters mysteries in the Spirit. [3] On the other hand, the one who prophesies speaks to people for their upbuilding and encouragement and consolation. [4] The one who speaks in a tongue builds up himself, but the one who prophesies builds up the church. [5] Now I want you all to speak in tongues, but even more to prophesy. The one who prophesies is greater than the one who speaks in tongues, unless someone interprets, so that the church may be built up. [6] Now, brothers, if I come to you speaking in tongues, how will I benefit you unless I bring you some revelation or knowledge or prophecy or teaching? [7] If even lifeless instruments, such as the flute or the harp, do not give distinct notes, how will anyone know what is played? [8] And if the bugle gives an indistinct sound, who will get ready for battle? [9] So with yourselves, if with your tongue you utter speech that is not intelligible, how will anyone know what is said? For you will be speaking into the air. [10] There are doubtless many different languages in the world, and none is without meaning, [11] but if I do not know the meaning of the language, I will be a foreigner to the speaker and the speaker a foreigner to me. [12] So with yourselves, since you are eager for manifestations of the Spirit, strive to excel in building up the church. [13] Therefore, one who speaks in a tongue should pray for the power to interpret. [14] For if I pray in a tongue, my spirit prays but my mind is unfruitful. [15] What am I to do? I will pray with my spirit, but I will pray with my mind also; I will sing praise with my spirit, but I will sing with my mind also. [16] Otherwise, if you give thanks with your spirit, how can anyone in the position of an outsider say "Amen" to your thanksgiving when he does not know what you are saying? [17] For you may be giving thanks well enough, but the other person is not being built up. [18] I thank God that I speak in tongues more than all of you. [19] Nevertheless, in church I would rather speak five words with my mind in order to instruct others, than ten thousand words in a tongue. [20] Brothers, do not be children in your thinking. Be infants in evil, but in your thinking be mature. [21] In the Law it is written, "By people of strange tongues and by the lips of foreigners will I speak to this people, and even then they will not listen to me, says the Lord." [22] Thus tongues are a sign not for believers but for unbelievers, while prophecy is a sign not for unbelievers but for believers. [23] If, therefore, the whole church comes together and all speak in tongues, and outsiders or unbelievers enter, will they not say that you are out of your minds? [24] But if all prophesy, and an unbeliever or outsider enters, he is convicted by all, he is called to account by all, [25] the secrets of his heart are disclosed, and so, falling on his face, he will worship God and declare that God is really among you. [26] What then, brothers? When you come together, each one has a hymn, a lesson, a revelation, a tongue, or an interpretation. Let all things be done for building up. [27] If any speak in a tongue, let there be only two or at most three, and each in turn, and let someone interpret. [28] But if there is no one to interpret, let each of them keep silent in church and speak to himself and to God. [29] Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said. [30] If a revelation is made to another sitting there, let the first be silent. [31] For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged, [32] and the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets. [33] For God is not a God of confusion but of peace. 1 Cor. 12:28-29 And God has appointed in the church first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, then miracles, then gifts of healing, helping, administrating, and various kinds of tongues. [29] Are all apostles? Are all prophets? Are all teachers? Do all work miracles? John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Yes, I agree, I am using the term 'church' in the generally accepted sense, knowing that is not what it really means. "Then this means another thing then, in those members you have True Christian Unity, all are one in Him and all else falls short of that mark." This forum is evidence the SDA does not have this. I think you're overstating it, though, I think so long as there is unity on the core issues, there is nothing wrong with some discussion of incidental things in the church. "EGW's goal and purpose was to be a lesser light to lead to the Greater Light, Jesus Christ and His Wonderful True Word that leads one to Him, The Life that All may obtain eternal Life through Him. " Sure, assuming that such a light was needed, and that the Greater Light was still insufficient. The core issue is that there's no concept of addition revelation from 'special' prophets in the NT. Someone who expounds scripture is something God always provides the church, and someone who can tell the future, claims to add to Revelation and is cursed.
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 Not sure what you think this adds. Verse 5 is talking about behaviour, not ability. The core point is, if I am wrong, then some Christians are, in Paul's words, 'greater' than others. Verse 24 is talking about, if all use the gift, not if all can. Verse 31 means what it says. In context, just to be completely clear: [27] If any speak in a tongue, let there be only two or at most three, and each in turn, and let someone interpret. [28] But if there is no one to interpret, let each of them keep silent in church and speak to himself and to God. Tongues should be used in the church only if someone is willing to interpret, by inspiration of God. Otherwise, if tongues is not used in the church, the place it is used, is to speak to oneself and to God ( that is, not as a gift of languages to use when talking to people ) [29] Let two or three prophets speak, and let the others weigh what is said. [30] If a revelation is made to another sitting there, let the first be silent. Sometimes when people speak out in prophecy, two people start at the same moment. Paul is saying, if you think you started first, then you stop. In other words, he inverts the usual 'I started first, so I should continue' logic that humans would have, indicating that we should care more about the church running in order, than in taking our turn. [31] For you can all prophesy one by one, so that all may learn and all be encouraged, [32] and the spirits of prophets are subject to prophets. These two verses, in context, hammer home this point. If you stop when you started first, no-one will doubt that you have the gift, you should not seek to use it to glorify yourself. Why ? Because everyone can prophecy, no-one was waiting to see if you have the gift or not. Verse 32 cuts off the 'the Spirit inspired me and I could not stop' argument so prevalent in Pentecost today. He's saying, I told you how to use the gifts, don't make excuses or think you have to prove something or use the gifts for your own glory. [33] For God is not a God of confusion but of peace. This is his core point, order in church meetings. 1Cr 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord. 1Cr 14:38 But if any man be ignorant, let him be ignorant. Once again, he's saying this is addressed to people who want to be thought of as prophets. 1Cr 14:39 Wherefore, brethren, covet to prophesy, and forbid not to speak with tongues. Why covet prophecy, but just forbid not tongues ? They all spoke in tongues already, by definition, disorderly use of tongues is the point of these three chapters. But, why covet what you can't have, why not also address clearly that only some have it, but all are saved regardless ? 1Cr 14:40 Let all things be done decently and in order. The core point of all this.
Moderators Gerr Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 The real question is, why can't I just read the Bible, why do I HAVE to read Ellen White ? If those who followed her deny the salvation experience that the Bible offers, then it seems fair to assume she didn't have the Spirit, but, of course, that is between her and God and not really my business, except to the degree I am expected to regard her as a 'super Christian' who I should look to as a guide to understanding and following God. You don't have to read ANY other author besides the Bible to arrive at Biblical truth. Do you have any religious books other than the Bible? Why? You might have some light that would take me a lot longer to discover if you or others would not point out to me. People can be a help or a detriment to the discovery of truth. That's why we have to be careful that what we read from others is consistent with what the Bible says. All I'm saying about EGW to you in the above quote is that if you are ever curious enough to REALLY know what she says, you might want to check out the books I mentioned. And where does she deny the salvation experience that someone has? The Bible does, however, say that "not everyone that says Lord, Lord" shall enter the kingdom of heaven, "but he who does the will of God." John, the Apostle that is, clearly say, "He who says 'I know Him' but does not keep His commandments is a liar, and the truth is not in him."
Moderators John317 Posted December 18, 2011 Moderators Posted December 18, 2011 The point is that not all are prophets and not all speak in tongues. John 3:16-17 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life. [17] For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but in order that the world might be saved through him.
BibleOnly Posted December 18, 2011 Author Posted December 18, 2011 The point is that not all are prophets and not all speak in tongues. The point is that if this is true, then not all have faith, wisdom or discernment according to Paul.
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