When Christ's character shall be perfectly reproduced in his people...

[Richard Holbrook]

I'm sorry about those things I said.

[Richard Holbrook]

Wayfinder, where did you come up with that date?

We (SDA) will have from 2012 (June-July) until 2016 (shaking).

[wayfinder]

All is forgiven, my friend.

[Richard Holbrook]

Thank You

[wayfinder]

I started fresh. All the time periods that were specifically for the end time I left just as God gave them (days, months, years). By doing this I was able to see a reference point where two dates were a known length of time apart. Incidentally, this is a rethinking of our entire eschatology, if this bothers you I will stop here.

[Richard Holbrook]

We're not supposed to set dates right?

[wayfinder]

I have not set a date, although I admit it appears that way, but I do study time and timing. My understanding is this, if God gave us specific periods of time in the apocalyptic prophecies then they must be for some specific reason. The only purpose I can think of is to know how they relate to each other and what God is intending us to understand about them.

[John317]

You started fresh but just so happened to come to the same conclusions as Dr. Rich and Musicman and a few other people attending a particular "class."

[John317]

After God gave directions to Eve, what should she have done? Should she have walked over to the tree and started talking with the serpent? Wasn't that the beginning of her Fall?

[wayfinder]

You mean my Sabbath School class. Dr. Rich is his own person, he is my friend, but he can rub me the wrong way from time to time. As far as the conclusions, he got them from me, Dr. Rich just has a unique way of expressing them.

[Richard Holbrook]

After God gave directions to Eve, what should she have done? Should she have walked over to the tree and started talking with the serpent? Wasn't that the beginning of her Fall?

That was directed at me wasn't it?

[Richard Holbrook]

You're right John, but I was curious.

[Richard Holbrook]

That's probably what Eve said.

[John317]

When we know that someone is teaching things from Satan, and we continue to look into those ideas and dialog about them, we remove ourselves from God's protection. That is presumption, the same as Eve did when she went to the tree. Once there, she could no longer count on the protection of God's angels.

Ever heard of Moses Hull? That is what happened to him. He knew that certain people were teaching doctrines of devils, but he kept meeting them, and he ended up teaching the same doctrines. He moved from debating against the immortality of the soul to defending and building up spiritualism.

Interesting story on Moses Hull, in wikipedia--

Quote:

Born in Waldo, Ohio, Hull was a member of the United Brethren Church in his teens. He joined the Seventh-day Adventist Church in 1857, and became a prominent minister and debater for that denomination. In September 1863, Hull preached his last sermon as an Adventist minister.

Around this time, he turned most of energies towards the promotion of

Spiritualism, specifically Christian Spiritualism, which saw spirit communication as the culmination of Christianity. He gained prominence in the movement for a series of debates with ministers, the outcome of which was evident in that the spiritualists rather than the ministers had the transcripts published.

Hull became identified largely with Victoria Woodhull and the womens' rights wing of the movement, which launched the Equal Rights Party campaign in 1872. Later, he became a national leader of the Greenback-Labor Party and various attempts to secure more rights for the farmers, the workers and women.

Soon after, he divorced his wife, Elvira, and married fellow spiritualist Mattie Brown Sawyer. In 1903, he founded the Morris Pratt Institute in Whitewater, Wisconsin. He ran for Congress in 1906 on the ticket of the Socialist Party, and died in January 1907.

What this article doesn't mention is that Hull started meeting these spiritualists in private when he knew they were teaching error, and after SDAs had warned him not to meet with the spiritualists. It was soon after that when he threw his energies behind the doctrines he had once opposed.

[Richard Holbrook]

No I never heard of him, but I see what you mean.

[Maschil]

people are time setting??? This can't be true...

[Richard Holbrook]

But if I stay on this forum, I will have to argue against this stuff.

[Richard Holbrook]

Oh it's true. That's not the half of it.

[Maschil]

I'm with you, the Bible itself disapproves time setting... and if that isn't enough proof have an indirect source of truth of Ellen White.

[Richard Holbrook]

These people have thrown out EGW and the writings of Paul and Luke.

[John317]

There are people who are here to do the work of Satan. He is real as you and I are, and this "war" is as real as any military battle by humans.

Check this out:

http://books.google.com/books?id=o4IjxRY...;q=&f=false

[Maschil]

These people have thrown out EGW and the writings of Paul and Luke.

still got Peter and John Himself.... also can you pm me the names...i really didn't think this was an issue with all the history we have of time setting. Its ironic, that an Adventist would time set---when we are part of the reason why we still here.

It seems best to set a date in which we would fully commit our lives to God with reservation. Then as Rom 9:28 puts it God can finish the work and cut is short in righteousness....

[wayfinder]

I am sorry to be perceived as such an evil person, I guess time will tell.

Incedently, God did not tell Eve not to eat from the tree, He told Adam.

Ge 2:16,17 The LORD God commanded the man, saying, "From any tree of the garden you may eat freely; but from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat from it you will surely die."

Ge 2:21:22 So the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon the man, and he slept; then He took one of his ribs and closed up the flesh at that place. The LORD God fashioned into a woman the rib which He had taken from the man, and brought her to the man.

[Robert]

Incedently, God did not tell Eve not to eat from the tree, He told Adam.

Yes, but apparently Eve knew:

1 Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?" 2 The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, 3 but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.'"

[John317]

I am sorry to be perceived as such an evil person, I guess time will tell.

Incedently, God did not tell Eve not to eat from the tree, He told Adam.

You are right that God told Adam directly, but we know that Eve knew about the prohibition from God, and that is what's important here, not how Eve learned of the prohibition.