What does this mean?

[pnattmbtc]

No, Robert, it's not the same. I explained why your question was out of order. Your response to my explanation was "whatever."

[Robert]

"Jesus...thought not, planned not, lived not, for himself" - can you say the same of yourself? Yes?

[Robert]

"Jesus...thought not, planned not, lived not, for himself" - can you say the same of yourself? Yes?

It's so quite! teehe How quite? Listen:

[Guest]

It's so quite! teehe How quite? Listen:

Did you mean to say quiet?

[Musicman1228]

Hey Guys,

On the subject of PROOF; what proof did Jesus have that HE was the Son of God? He obviously had memories from before the world was created, He had memories of talking with Abraham. How could this be? How did He learn what He knew about Scripture? Personally, I don't say Mary taught Him because she (as with most women of her day) did not have any formal education that would translate into the kind of knowledge of Scripture that Jesus displayed in confronting the experts on the Law.

I am interested in your different perspectives on this.

[pnattmbtc]

Quote:

He obviously had memories from before the world was created, He had memories of talking with Abraham.

This isn't at all obvious.

Quote:

Personally, I don't say Mary taught Him because she (as with most women of her day) did not have any formal education that would translate into the kind of knowledge of Scripture that Jesus displayed in confronting the experts on the Law.

His parents could have taught Jesus, but also the Holy Spirit taught Him.

[pnattmbtc]

Quote:

"Jesus...thought not, planned not, lived not, for himself" - can you say the same of yourself? Yes?

You would be more pleasant to converse with if you listened to what another was saying, and responded to that.

[Guest]

Quote:

He obviously had memories from before the world was created, He had memories of talking with Abraham.

This isn't at all obvious.

Quote:

Personally, I don't say Mary taught Him because she (as with most women of her day) did not have any formal education that would translate into the kind of knowledge of Scripture that Jesus displayed in confronting the experts on the Law.

His parents could have taught Jesus, but also the Holy Spirit taught Him.

Amen

[Dr. Rich]

Woody started this thread with this: "I was shown that the judgments of God would NOT come DIRECTLY out from the Lord upon the wicked but in this way.: They place themselves beyond His protection... He warns, corrects, reproves, and points out the only path of safety; then, if they choose their own way, then He does not commission His angels to prevent Satan's decided attacks upon them." Manuscripts Releases, Vol.14,3.1

What do I think that this means? It means that EGW was being shown things that could not be from God. We were taught as kids that the angels would not go into a theater with us because of this nonsense.

Here is the thing: Our choices are completely ours. Please read what God said to Cain before Cain killed his brother. It is our job to be a master over Satan and when we chose Jesus' words and teachings over Satan's, then our prayers will be heard, but it is still our own choice.

[Robert]

Originally Posted By: Robert

It's so quite! teehe How quite? Listen:

Did you mean to say quiet?

Yes, I did....Thank you.

[Robert]

Quote:

"Jesus...thought not, planned not, lived not, for himself" - can you say the same of yourself? Yes?

You would be more pleasant to converse with if you listened to what another was saying, and responded to that.

Yeah, maybe, but no one...I mean no one has responded to my question! Why? As I said...(after being corrected) - it's very quiet.

[Robert]

Jesus "thought not, planned not, lived not, for himself." Can you say the same? [#349140 - 04/02/10 02:41 AM ]

Let's see, it has been 4 days and no one has answered this question.

This is the problem with the self-righteous. They are too proud to admit that they are not measuring up to the righteousness of Christ, which is unrighteousness.

Like I said, even though we experience change, we are saved by what Christ did 2000 years ago in our humanity.

[Musicman1228]

I will respond with this:

Jesus did think, plan and live for Himself, in this regard; His mind IS the mind of God, and He only did the will of His Father. Therefore, to go against the will of His Father would be going against His own will. His Father sent Him to earth to testify to the Truth, and then die to pay the penalty (of disobedience) for His Kingdom. He could do nothing but what it was in His mind to do. If He would have disobeyed His Father He would have disobeyed Himself, therefore He, being true to self He did what He wanted to do, an action that saved the Kingdom of Heaven and preserved His own identity as God.

The temptation of Jesus in the desert before the beginning of His ministry was designed to by Satan to get Jesus to give up His Godness, and this He would NEVER do. Satan did not understand the power of the motivation within Jesus Christ to continue to BE God. This shows that in one important sense Jesus was thinking and planning and living for Himself. If we had the mind of God in us we would do the same, and NEVER sin again.

[wayfinder]

The following text would indicate that Jesus did think for Himself, but His thoughts were also the thoughts of the Father. His actions were the actions of the Father. His plans were also the plans of the Father. The life He lived was His and the Father's. The main function of truth is that being singular and absolute it unifies. Jesus said "I and the Father are One, how can this be when they are two beings, they are unified by the truth. Jesus came to testify to the truth so that those who would believe His testimony would become one with Him and the Father and Spirit of God. This unity is what He prayed for as recorded in John 17. Jesus also expresses His knowledge of how this unity comes about, when He says, "scantify them with the truth, Thy word is truth. Jesus opened the door to oneness (atonement) through the learning, living and practicing and worship in truth. There was nothing in Jesus that was not in the Father and nothing outside of Him that was not outside of the Father.

John 10:25 Jesus answered them, "I told you, and you do not believe ; the works that I do in My Father's name, these testify of Me.

26 "But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep.

27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me;

28 and I give eternal life to them, and they will never perish ; and no one will snatch them out of My hand.

29 "My Father, who has given them to Me, is greater than all ; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand.

30 "I and the Father are one."

31 The Jews picked up stones again to stone Him.

32 Jesus answered them, "I showed you many good works from the Father ; for which of them are you stoning Me?"

33 The Jews answered Him, "For a good work we do not stone You, but for blasphemy ; and because You, being a man, make Yourself out to be God."

[pnattmbtc]

Quote:

Yeah, maybe, but no one...I mean no one has responded to my question! Why? As I said...(after being corrected) - it's very quiet.

You haven't given a satisfactory response as to why you're asking the question. It's been pointed out to you why your question is out of order, and your response was "whatever."

[Dr. Rich]

Robert, you are wrong. Please check my post #349712 a few days ago and you will see that I answered your question and responded to it correctly. So don't say that no one responded.

[Robert]

Jesus did...live for Himself

Then Jesus was a sinner....

Jesus never lived for Himself. Everything He did was for humanity...a humanity that hated God and loved self....

There was no self-seeking in Christ's life. He didn't attend school to make money...have a nice home. He didn't compete for position...in fact the Bible said He was slave of all. He lived not for Himself, but another's wealth.

[Robert]

Robert, Jesus said that He laid down His life and took it up again on His own--right? If so, then your quote from whoever is wrong as Jesus had His own brain to think, plan and do things on His own, but He also said His whole mission was to testify to the truth and speak the words that His Father wanted Him to speak.

You ask if I am Christ like and I would like to think I am--but also know I have not been sealed. My motto is to seek ye first the KOH and His righteousness!

I never said Jesus didn't think....I said Jesus never lived for Himself. He lived to serve. You, as a sinner, live to serve yourself. That's bent to self...that's iniquity.

From your birth your mind was concerned primarily about one person - yourself! Everything you did was orchastred to promote self. Even the good things you did were done for self-centered reasons. This is true of all of us. And while we become less selfish through Christ the law still recognizes us as sinners. So you can never gain heaven by your performance.

[Musicman1228]

Robert, you obviously did not really read my post if you didn't understand what I said. Of course Jesus lived for others, but in order to be able to do that He also had to be true to His own nature, which was that of God. Jesus had NO propensity to sin, because He IS God, and in God there is NO sin. If He did not do what His Father sent Him to do He would have sinned, because He would have gone against His own Nature.

As human beings we have to do something that Jesus never had to do, that is overcome our sinful nature, which is expressed in us even down to our DNA. Jesus did not have a sinful nature to overcome (either physically or spiritually), which is why He said we would do greater things that He did through the power of the Holy Spirit.

“Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever believes in me will also do the works that I do; and greater works than these will he do, because I am going to the Father. John 14:12.

In order to remain 'God' Jesus had to remain true to Himself, that is true to who He was as the Son of God. Yes, Jesus could have chosen to sin by bowing down to the Prince of this world, Satan, but He would never do this because He was God and had no inclination to disobey His Father. This is why I maintain that Jesus did think of Himself, as in 'know' Himself, and what He was sent to earth to accomplish. Without this self awareness Jesus could not have remained God under the temptations of Satan. In this sense He did live for Himself, because if He did not live for Himself there would be no way that we could ever find our lives in Him.

[Dr. Rich]

Hey Robert, what is a 'bondservant' for Jesus?

[Robert]

Of course Jesus lived for others

You are missing out....Jesus never lived for Himself! On the other hand you were born bent to self. You didn't get your wealth by accident. You worked for it and you did so by thinking a lot of yourself. That's iniquity.

[Robert]

Let's do this again:

"Jesus...thought not, planned not, lived not, for himself." In heaven you will do the same. Hence, "none will think of self,...but all, from pure, genuine (agape) love, will seek the happiness of the heavenly beings around them." And how will this take place - by looking out for yourself? No! Instead "you will have that love which seeks not her own, but another's wealth."

If you guys lived Christ's life here on earth you would share His poverty as well. Hence, "those who follow Him [walk as He walked] must share his poverty."

[Guest]

Somebody skip the needle already. It's in the same groove it was ten pages ago.

[Robert]

Somebody skip the needle already. It's in the same groove it was ten pages ago.

Are you free of selfishness or are you bent to self?

Jack:

At its very best, human love is self-seeking. Since we are by nature egocentric, everything we do or think, in and of ourselves, is polluted with self-love or selfishness. Socially, politically, academically, materially, economically, even religiously, we are all slaves to “our own way” [isaiah 53:6; cf. Philippians 2:21]. As we saw in the previous chapter, we are all shaped in “iniquity”; that is, we are bent toward self. Consequently, we all, without exception, fall short of God’s glory, His agape love [see Romans 3:23].

All of you have serious eye problems....You really can't see that compared to Christ your goodness is dung....You need to give up your self-righteousness for the righteousness of Christ or I can guarantee you that you will not enter into heaven!

Rob

[Guest]

Number nine...number nine...number nine...number nine?