Football and Adventism

[olger]

Bless YOU.

[Guest]

Thank you. :)

[BobRyan]

I appreciate the "Blessings".

Blessings to you my friend.

in Christ,

Bob

[doug yowell]

Ending a discussion on pox with the word "blessings" ... just seems like a contradiction.

Why? I would think that the elimination of small pox would be a real blessing!!

[Guest]

Originally Posted By: RLH

I appreciate the "Blessings".

Blessings to you my friend.

in Christ,

Bob

Likewise, brother. )

[Guest]

I would think that the elimination of small pox would be a real blessing!!

Indeed!

[BobRyan]

Quote:

Christ looks upon a world filled with the din of merchandise and trade, with the dishonesty and scheming of buyers and sellers. In their desire to get gain, men have lost sight of the laws of justice and equity. “It is naught, it is naught, saith the buyer: but when he is gone his way, then he boasteth.” Satan has devised a multitude of ways in which to keep men from serving God. He has invented sports and games, into which men enter with such intensity that one would suppose a crown of life was to reward the winner. At the horse races and football matches, which are attended by thousands and thousands of people, lives for which Christ shed His blood are thrown away. What will become of the souls of the men and boys whose lives are thus extinguished? Will they be counted worthy of the redemption which Christ died to secure for them? {RH September 10, 1901, par. 5}

Looking upon these God-dishonoring scenes, Christ asks, “What is a man profited, if he gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?” He calls the attention of men to the nobler world which they have lost from view. He points them to the threshold of heaven, flushed with the glory of the infinite God. {RH September 10, 1901, par. 6}

When I read the above - I am confronted by the conviction that many SDAs have never even seen this material. Some who have seen it choose to rebel against it - but most do not know it even exists.

in Christ,

Bob

[Woody]

Ahhh But BobRyan. Keep digging ... there's much much more. Many a 'gem' to be found. ha ha

[CoAspen]

I thought people were agreed on the eradication of 'pox'??

[LoneRanger]

Quote:

Christ looks upon a world filled with the din of merchandise and trade, with the dishonesty and scheming of buyers and sellers. In their desire to get gain, men have lost sight of the laws of justice and equity. “It is naught, it is naught, saith the buyer: but when he is gone his way, then he boasteth.” Satan has devised a multitude of ways in which to keep men from serving God. He has invented sports and games, into which men enter with such intensity that one would suppose a crown of life was to reward the winner. At the horse races and football matches, which are attended by thousands and thousands of people, lives for which Christ shed His blood are thrown away. What will become of the souls of the men and boys whose lives are thus extinguished? Will they be counted worthy of the redemption which Christ died to secure for them? {RH September 10, 1901, par. 5}

Looking upon these God-dishonoring scenes, Christ asks, “What is a man profited, if he gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?” He calls the attention of men to the nobler world which they have lost from view. He points them to the threshold of heaven, flushed with the glory of the infinite God. {RH September 10, 1901, par. 6}

When I read the above - I am confronted by the conviction that many SDAs have never even seen this material. Some who have seen it choose to rebel against it - but most do not know it even exists.

in Christ,

Bob

Quite the contrary, Bob. We are well aware of its existance, having had it thrust upon us as evil youngsters just wanting to have some fun.

I'm afraid this is one of those examples where EGW gets carried away with her own emotionalism. It also demonstrates her complete lack of a "middle ground," something which has pervaded Adventism since its inception. (Especiall in her early works) Yes, there are those who "enter with such intensity that one would suppose a crown of life was to reward the winner." (They are also a pain in the butt to the rest of us) But most play for exercise, fun and companionship. Hardly great evils.

[BobRyan]

Quote:

Christ looks upon a world filled with the din of merchandise and trade, with the dishonesty and scheming of buyers and sellers. In their desire to get gain, men have lost sight of the laws of justice and equity. “It is naught, it is naught, saith the buyer: but when he is gone his way, then he boasteth.” Satan has devised a multitude of ways in which to keep men from serving God. He has invented sports and games, into which men enter with such intensity that one would suppose a crown of life was to reward the winner. At the horse races and football matches, which are attended by thousands and thousands of people, lives for which Christ shed His blood are thrown away. What will become of the souls of the men and boys whose lives are thus extinguished? Will they be counted worthy of the redemption which Christ died to secure for them? {RH September 10, 1901, par. 5}

Looking upon these God-dishonoring scenes, Christ asks, “What is a man profited, if he gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?” He calls the attention of men to the nobler world which they have lost from view. He points them to the threshold of heaven, flushed with the glory of the infinite God. {RH September 10, 1901, par. 6}

When I read the above - I am confronted by the conviction that many SDAs have never even seen this material. Some who have seen it choose to rebel against it - but most do not know it even exists.

[LoneRanger]

Because that is how prophecy works??

Did you find such a principle in the Bible??

[joeb]

Quote:

So I'm sure YOU never bought any school photos and sent them to Grandma, or took idolotrous pictures of your child's birthday party, or graduation, or...Well, you get the picture.

I'm not Bob, but I'll take a stab at this.

From what you said earlier about not studying Ellen White, well, a quote as obscure as this can only be found by studying her writings to find something to cavil about.

If you had been interested in finding out the truth about this statement you could have easily found it. The context is in the paragraphs immediately preceeding it.

Quote:

As I visit the homes of our people and our schools, I see that all the available space on tables, what-nots, and mantelpieces is filled up with photographs. On the right hand and on the left are seen the pictures of human faces. God desires this order of things to be changed. Were Christ on earth, he would say, “Take these things hence.” I have been instructed that these pictures are as so many idols, taking up the time and thought which should be sacredly devoted to God. {RH June 13, 1907, par. 2}

These photographs cost money. Is it consistent for us, knowing the work that is to be done at this time, to spend God’s money in producing pictures of our own faces and the faces of our friends? Should not every dollar that we can spare be used in the upbuilding of the cause of God? These pictures take money that should be sacredly devoted to God’s service; and they divert the mind from the truths of God’s Word

As is readily obvious the issue is not so much with photographs, as it is with the money being spent on them rather than investing that money in God's work. At that time photography was very expensive, just like bicycles. It was also a fad/obsession with many people. They would spend money on these things that they couldn't afford. Thus, the photos became an idol because they were being put ahead of God's work and taking the mind away from God as they were being obsessed over. The same is true of anything we put ahead of God in our lives.

The fact that you see this as worthy of sarcasm says a lot.

[Woody]

I thought people were agreed on the eradication of 'pox'??

I agree. And we DO need a LOT more eradications here.

[Woody]

Quote:

I don't study Ellen White; I study the Bible.

Which is exactly what her message to us was to do.

IOWs you are doing as EGW told you to do.

[Woody]

Quote:

So I'm sure YOU never bought any school photos and sent them to Grandma, or took idolotrous pictures of your child's birthday party, or graduation, or...Well, you get the picture

Good Point.

[LoneRanger]

From what you said earlier about not studying Ellen White, well, a quote as obscure as this can only be found by studying her writings to find something to cavil about

[LoneRanger]

IOWs you are doing as EGW told you to do.

Yes, and a thousand other God-fearing people like Origin, Augustine, Luther, Wesley, Calvin, Arminius, Pope John Paul ll, HMS Richards, Billy Graham, Mother Teresa, the Apostle Peter, the Apostle Paul, Desmond Ford, Robert Brinsmead, Wagonner and Jones, Oswald Chambers, E.P. Saunders...

[CoAspen]

I see no sarcasm but a pun!

It is pointing out how often the pick and choose and context is used and not used!!

A valid point!

[Woody]

I see no sarcasm but a pun!

It is pointing out how often the pick and choose and context is used and not used!!

A valid point!

[joeb]

Originally Posted By: joeb

From what you said earlier about not studying Ellen White, well, a quote as obscure as this can only be found by studying her writings to find something to cavil about

I said I don't (present continuous) study her. I did not say I've never studied her or am unfamiliar with her.

Originally Posted By: joeb

If you had been interested in finding out the truth about this statement you could have easily found it. The context is in the paragraphs immediately preceeding it.

I'm not sure YOU are qualified to comment on MY interests or motivation.

Originally Posted By: joeb

As is readily obvious the issue is not so much with photographs, as it is with the money being spent on them rather than investing that money in God's work. At that time photography was very expensive, just like bicycles. It was also a fad/obsession with many people. They would spend money on these things that they couldn't afford. Thus, the photos became an idol because they were being put ahead of God's work and taking the mind away from God as they were being obsessed over. The same is true of anything we put ahead of God in our lives.

Not surprisingly, you missed the point. So I presume you don't have a cell phone, iPhone, Blackberry, or whatever, since they are a fad and expensive. Let's extend that to ANYTYHING you don't ABSOLUTELY need, based on this statement:

Originally Posted By: EGW

Should not every dollar that we can spare be used in the upbuilding of the cause of God?

Originally Posted By: joeb

The fact that you see this as worthy of sarcasm says a lot.

Wanna start a new thread on that?

For your information, about what I bolded, I don't. I did have to carry a cell phone for years though. My job required I stay in contact at all times, and carry an extensive list of easily accessible contacts. No longer in that line of work, so I no longer carry such an intrusive device.

So, you posted this trying to find someone in a sin because you didn't like what they've posted, all the while ignoring the context of the quote you used, and you don't see that as sarcasm at best?

The context of the football issue is the same. It's time spent doing something that does anything but point us toward God. It(football), in fact, promotes the devil's line of thinking. Thus it is just as much of an idol as anything else that we do(cling to) that points us away from God.

[lazarus]

Joeb, just out of curiosity, do you think cell phones are of the devil?

[LoneRanger]

For your information, about what I bolded, I don't. I did have to carry a cell phone for years though. My job required I stay in contact at all times, and carry an extensive list of easily accessible contacts. No longer in that line of work, so I no longer carry such an intrusive device.

[Ted Oplinger]

Joeb, just out of curiosity, do you think cell phones are of the devil?

Oy, Laz...you just HAVE to stir the pot, don't you???

Blessings,

[lazarus]

Joeb, just out of curiosity, do you think cell phones are of the devil?

Oy, Laz...you just HAVE to stir the pot, don't you???

Blessings,

I'm seriously interested, honest.