Luther on the Antichrist

[Robert]

Robert, why don't you lay it out....

Here are two clues - one from the Bible and two from Ellen White:

2 Cor 5:14 "For the love (agape) of Christ constrains us; because we judge thus, that one (Christ as the son of man - i.e., the second Adam) died for all, therefore all died.

"Humanity died; divinity did not die."

"Deity did not die. Humanity died"

What's my point?

Paul informs us that when Christ (as the son of man) died that "all died"! The "all" was "humanity" - the human race.

That's what the law demands - it demands that "the soul that sins it must die". Hence, "in Christ" our humanity took the curse of the law.

[Robert]

So your humanity died in Christ. He, Christ as God, assumed your fallen humanity at the incarnation. This qualified Him to be your substitute. Hence you can say that your "old life was crucified with Him". And you can also say "you died to the law in the body of Christ". Therefore "by dying to what once bound us (the law), we have been released from the law (the law is legally satisfied with our death in Christ) so that we serve in the new way of the Spirit, and not in the old way of the written code (the Old Covenant). This answers the justice of the law (disobey and die).

[Guest]

Originally Posted By: Gibs

I find your question has been answered ....

No, it hasn't....All you've said is God can do as He pleases. That's not an answer, that's nonsense for God cannot and will not sin.

God has the right to do some things that you do not have the right to do.

You are not equal to God. For you to suggest that it is a sin for God to do something that you can't understand with your little human pea brain, borderlines on the worst kind of blasphemy.

God does not work on the plan of man. He can do infinite justice that man has no right to do before his fellow man. Noah would have displeased God to have drowned one of the scoffers and mockers that harassed him, but God drowned the vast world. {LDE 241.2}

[Q.E.D.]

God has the right to do some things that you do not have the right to do.

You are not equal to God. For you to suggest that it is a sin for God to do something that you can't understand with your little human pea brain, borderlines on the worst kind of blasphemy.

God does not work on the plan of man. He can do infinite justice that man has no right to do before his fellow man. Noah would have displeased God to have drowned one of the scoffers and mockers that harassed him, but God drowned the vast world. {LDE 241.2}

Q.E.D.

[Guest]

So your humanity died in Christ.

Not according to Paul. He said he has to die daily. And run the race, etc. And if it did, you would no longer have any temptation to do anything against God's law. What purpose would it serve?

The only reason Satan tempts you, is because he knows that you can still be lost. (His ONLY goal)

So if you still have temptation, then you still have your humanity.

1Co 10:13 No temptation has overtaken you except what is common to humanity. God is faithful and He will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation He will also provide a way of escape, so that you are able to bear it. {HCSB}

[Robert]

Noah would have displeased God to have drowned one of the scoffers and mockers that harassed him, but God drowned the vast world.

[Robert]

Not according to Paul. He said he has to die daily.

RLH (and others)...you are legalists. That means you have no idea what constitutes the gospel and therefore you are ultimately relying on your performance to save you. You are not resting in Christ's finished works and hence you are also breaking the Sabbath as a sign of JBF.

[Guest]

So, anything that refutes your false assertions is off topic? I see.

[Guest]

The only reason Satan tempts you, is because he knows that you can still be lost. (His ONLY goal)

So if you still have temptation, then you still have your humanity. If it's gone then you cannot be tempted.

I little common sense goes a long way Robert. God expects you to use what little He has given..

[Robert]

So if you still have temptation, then you still have your humanity.

I am a child of Adam. I have his fallen nature...his fallen humanity. I was born bent to self. I cannot take my humanity to heaven, but "in Christ" I am sitting in the heavenly places. In Christ I have a glorified humanity that He obtained by His doing and dying.

Eph 2:4 But God, who is rich in mercy, because of His great love with which He loved us, 5 even when we were dead in trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace you have been saved), 6 and raised us up together, and made us sit together in the heavenly places in Christ Jesus

Notice,

1] Christ saved me when I was His enemy. He saved me when I was living fully for the flesh (my bent to self).

2] I have a glorified humanity in Christ in the heaven itself. I receive this life at the 2nd coming. He is the last Adam (the 2nd Adam)

[Robert]

Where did you come from, RHL? Please don't tell me your mother. Go back further. Who are you original parents?

[Guest]

Eph 2:4 (by grace you have been saved)

Look up that word in the original Greek. It doesn't mean what you think it does. It doesn't mean once and for always, regardless of what you do. That's what the Sunday churches preach, and it's not biblical.

You do know that you have to use the WHOLE bible to form correct doctrine, right? You can't just pick and choose verses, and then expand their meaning.

Saved:

G4982

sode'-zo

From a primary word sōs(contraction for the obsolete saos, “safe”); to save, that is, deliver or protect (literally or figuratively): - heal, preserve, save (self), do well, be (make) whole.

[Robert]

Where did you come from, RHL? Please don't tell me your mother. Go back further. Who are you original parents?

I'll help you: You came from Adam. Even Eve was taken from Adam's side.

Did Adam sin after or before he had children?

Answer: After.

Therefore his children were born with his humanity that is bent to self.

That's why David could say, "Behold, I was shapen (developed) in iniquity (our bent to self), And in sin (iniquity) my mother conceived me."

David was born a sinful, not by disobedience, but because Adam past to David a humanity indwelt with iniquity. We are born to a lost race....We stand condemned "in Adam" because all us (the human race) shares his humanity!

[Robert]

And you think you can be saved by your performance? Can you say delusional?

[phkrause]

God has the right to do some things that you do not have the right to do.

You are not equal to God. For you to suggest that it is a sin for God to do something that you can't understand with your little human pea brain, borderlines on the worst kind of blasphemy.

God does not work on the plan of man. He can do infinite justice that man has no right to do before his fellow man. Noah would have displeased God to have drowned one of the scoffers and mockers that harassed him, but God drowned the vast world. {LDE 241.2}

[Robert]

[phkrause]

Originally Posted By: Robert

So your humanity died in Christ.

Not according to Paul. He said he has to die daily. And run the race, etc. And if it did, you would no longer have any temptation to do anything against God's law. What purpose would it serve?

The only reason Satan tempts you, is because he knows that you can still be lost. (His ONLY goal)

So if you still have temptation, then you still have your humanity.

1Co 10:13 No temptation has overtaken you except what is common to humanity. God is faithful and He will not allow you to be tempted beyond what you are able, but with the temptation He will also provide a way of escape, so that you are able to bear it. {HCSB}

[Guest]

Performance will not save anybody, as I've pointed out many times. You intentionally miss the point, but that's ok.

[phkrause]

Originally Posted By: Robert

So, anything that refutes your false assertions is off topic? I see.

[Robert]

You are backing a perverted gospel....

[phkrause]

The only reason Satan tempts you, is because he knows that you can still be lost. (His ONLY goal)

So if you still have temptation, then you still have your humanity. If it's gone then you cannot be tempted.

I little common sense goes a long way Robert. God expects you to use what little He has given..

[Robert]

Performance will not save anybody...

Then it must be the gospel that saves, right?

If so how did you legally answer the law's demands (obey and live, disobey and die)?

The answer is the gospel - the "in Christ" motif.

The expression in Christ, however, is a rather difficult phrase to understand. Just as “you must be born again” was mind-boggling to Nicodemus; so likewise, the concept of in Christ is a very difficult idea for us to understand. This is especially true of the western mind. How can I, as an individual, be in someone else? Worse still, how could I, born in the twentieth century, have been in Christ who lived almost 2000 years ago? This makes absolutely no sense to our western way of thinking. As a result we miss the full blessing that God has prepared for us in Christ.

What does Scripture mean when it tells us that we were together with Christ in His death, burial, and resurrection, and now, are sitting with Him in heavenly places [Ephesians 2:5,6]? Because we cannot fathom these facts we tend to ignore or skim over them. Yet the whole understanding of the gospel hinges on our understanding the significance of these two vital words in Christ.

[Robert]

The Bible is clear that YOUR humanity (the one we received from Adam) died in the body of Christ. That's found in Romans 7:4. Paul also tells us that our old life from Adam was crucified with Christ. (Rom 6:6) And again, Paul tells us that when Christ, as the son of man, died "all" died in Him.

[Guest]

Are you cutting and pasting from Jack Seroquell again, but just not giving him credit?

[Robert]

Are you cutting and pasting from Jack Seroquell again, but just not giving him credit?

I'm giving you Paul. And Jack's last name is Sequeira. Maybe you should improve your spelling techniques?